The Crocodile Hunter with Brianna Bowman

You're Wrong About

In this episode, ocean correspondent Brianna Bowman joins Sarah to recount the life and legacy of Australian icon Steve Irwin. The discussio

Key takeaways

• Steve Irwin's passion for reptiles was nurtured by his parents, Bob and Lynn, who practiced wildlife rehabilitation at home.
• Before his television fame, Irwin worked professionally as a crocodile catcher for the Queensland National Parks and Wildlife Service.

Main topics

• Steve Irwin's childhood and family
• Wildlife rehabilitation and conservation

Notable quotes

Goodbye, little lizards.

Conclusion

A nostalgic and moving tribute that encourages listeners to reconnect

Transcript preview

Speaker 1 (0:00) I think we really missed out by not being marsupials. I'm going to start us off. I'm going to have a sip of tea. And then here's what we're going to do. I want to, at 12, check in about how we're doing in terms of pacing. Speaker 2 (0:25) You know me. It's Speaker 1 (0:27) like we've worked together before. It's Speaker 2 (0:29) like I have, you know, unexpectedly dropped a three-part series on you before. Speaker 1 (0:34) And we needed a three-part series, but Steve Irwin is a human-sized man, and so it must be shorter. Speaker 2 (0:39) Yeah. I mean, I think I could. Well, maybe not three parts. I probably could make it two parts, but I'm not going to. I promised Speaker 1 (0:46) you. You Speaker 2 (0:46) promised, but you Speaker 1 (0:46) can't. Speaker 2 (0:47) Yeah. I made a promise. We're going to leave all this in Speaker 1 (0:49) so people see what I have to deal with. Speaker 2 (0:54) Do you see? You're basically Pete from 30 Rock. This is Speaker 1 (0:57) like, you know what this is? This is karma because I used to freelance, as you know, when we were in our 20s. And I had editors being like, OK, I need this many words. And I was like, I can make it really long. And they're like, no. And now I'm the person who has to keep saying, no, it must be shorter. And I never thought that would happen to me. It's like parenthood, but editorially. Yeah. OK, well, anyway, Brianna. Speaker 2 (1:22) Sarah. Speaker 1 (1:23) You are our ocean correspondent, and yet today we are going on land. We Speaker 2 (1:28) are. It's Speaker 1 (1:29) a little confusing. We're going to put on our khakis. We're going to return to perhaps our childhoods. Speaker 2 (1:36) Absolutely. Speaker 1 (1:37) And we are going to talk about something I think people have been asking for for a long time, and that is the crocodile hunter, Steve Irwin. Speaker 2 (1:45) Steve Irwin, the man. The myth, the legend. Yeah. Speaker 1 (1:49) I Speaker 2 (1:50) don't know if he's really a myth, but he certainly is a legend to many people. You Speaker 1 (1:54) know, yeah. What's the difference? I don't know, but definitely the legend. Yeah. And you talked to us at the start of this year about Keiko. And here we are, I guess, for another biography of someone who a lot of us bonded with in our childhoods, I want to say. Speaker 2 (2:12) And I'm Speaker 1 (2:13) talking about millennials here. Speaker 2 (2:14) Yeah, Speaker 1 (2:15) exactly. Brianna, first of all, two questions in brief. Who are you? And I know that's Speaker 2 (2:21) a Speaker 1 (2:21) big one. Yeah. And you can answer it however you want, truly. And B, for someone who, for example, says I was born in October of 2006, who is Steve Irwin? Speaker 2 (2:33) Right. So I'm Brianna Bowman. I am currently a part-time host and reporter for... my local NPR member station, KLCC, Speaker 1 (2:45) based in Udine. You have the rom-com job of my dreams, and you are also, I will point out, much like Adrienne Barbeau in The Fog, a coastal radio gal. Yeah. What is that like generally to be talking about sort of a facet of the science world, which famously is having kind of a rough time with regards to people being proud to believe that science does not govern them in kind of a... you know, pretty worrying way that has gotten more political traction than it used to have. I think it's fair to say. Speaker 2 (3:15) And Speaker 1 (3:15) also like the difficult thing of communicating fairly specialized knowledge to people when you only have like so much time to do it. What is that like for you? Speaker 2 (3:24) I do find myself struggling. I'm learning, you know, like I was primarily trained as a scientist and now I am. learning on the fly on the job how to be a journalist. Yeah. Speaker 1 (3:37) And scientists do not tend to be rewarded for brevity, I would say. Speaker 2 (3:40) No. Speaker 1 (3:41) And scientists would say journalism frequently miscommunicates or over-dramatizes or clickbaits or simplifies an idea or makes little sound bites out of a complex interview in a way that compromises the average person's ability to even try to understand what's going on, to which I would say, yeah, that is absolutely true. Speaker 2 (4:01) Yes. I also kind of struggle with this idea of how much do we need to simplify all the time? Like, I think the interesting part are the details. And I get it. It's a news outlet. It's a news organization. And we need to be able to engage with the most people possible in terms of our audience and our listeners and our readers of our web articles. But yeah, sometimes I've kind of struggled with the idea of like. having to simplify things because I am like, well, yeah, maybe for some people that would be too much. And then for others, they would find that interesting. Like not going into details sometimes is maybe losing an opportunity to engage with people, but I'm still learning. And I think that's honestly the crux of a lot of discussion in the science communication field of, you know, how do we. engage people and educate people without overwhelming them with information because it is a scientist's job to understand every little detail right but how much does the average person actually need to know and Speaker 1 (5:09) how much time are they going to dedicate because this is my thing right where like here's an example um where i just got to visit gettysburg this year which is like really cool and amazing and great right and the thing is like Speaker 2 (5:22) because i Speaker 1 (5:23) think it's It's probably even maybe a cliche at this point that Gettysburg is beautiful. But like the thing is that it's so beautiful and it doesn't feel haunted at all. Oh, Speaker 2 (5:32) and there's something Speaker 1 (5:32) about that. And it's also been like, you know, painstakingly preserved to look the way it did at that time. There's something anyway. It's like a very powerful experience is what I'm getting at. You know, I won't talk too long about it. But also they like show you this film. And then the cyclorama, which I guess is a phenomenon of the late 19th century of like this giant circular painting that's supposed to give you an experience of like a period in history, a sort of feel immersive. It's like pre-IMAX or something or like being inside a giant zoetrope. Or Speaker 2 (6:03) pre-VR. Speaker 1 (6:04) Yeah. Yeah. It's like night. It's like Gilded Age VR. Speaker 2 (6:09) But anyway, they Speaker 1 (6:09) show this film and it's like very good. And they have Sam Waterston as Abraham Lincoln, because I guess after Ken Burns, everyone's like, yep, he's Abraham Lincoln. All right. And they read the Gettysburg Address, which is famously probably like the shortest important speech in American history. Like it's so short that you can like chisel it in its entirety onto like a piece of, you know, onto a monument and pretty large type. And they like. cut it at a certain point. They like faded out and then faded back in like they had cut out a part of it. I assume I might be wrong, but it really sure sounded like that. Interesting. And I was like, I don't know. I feel like people should be expected to sit through the additional 20 seconds or whatever you're saving here. Like, why would you cut this of all things if that's what happened? So I think that like there's this sense that like. we should make everything bite-sized because the American people are so stupid and impatient that we won't sit through anything. And it's like, yes, kind of like I can feel my attention span shrinking when I give into my desire to consume, you know, the kind of like social media stuff that I want, but also. That is an excuse, I think, that media companies use to try and make their products more and more addictive, to try and increase screen time quarter by quarter. Right. And a very sinister attempt, ultimately, to milk us of more and more of our time every year until we spend every waking second looking at a screen or using technology of some kind. Right. And it's not fair to blame a lazy people for the evil that corporations are doing to make us, I don't know, more addicted. to this stuff on purpose. And I also Speaker 2 (7:44) think that like Speaker 1 (7:44) boring stuff can be really good in challenging someone to like think a little bit longer or like sit with something in order to think harder about it, like is worth it. And if not everyone wants that, then that's okay. But of course that's not like a good approach capitalistically. Although interestingly, like the capitalist model in the United States today and media is in all things is to like execute a business model that doesn't have a chance of becoming profitable, suck it dry. and then abandon it after about seven years. I Speaker 2 (8:14) know. I never really understood that aspect of it. It's kind of the same idea. Like I've never quite understood or I have misgivings about the idea of the intention of like going into buying a home with the intention of selling it again one day. Speaker 1 (8:32) Well, yeah, because it can get predatory pretty easily, I think. Speaker 2 (8:36) Right. What if you just like created the home you wanted and didn't care about whether or not someone like the next buyer. No, Speaker 1 (8:43) Brianna, we must always profit max each activity. Have a hobby, make it a business. Buying a home, make it a business. Have a business, make it a bigger business. This is the American way. Right. Drop dead of a heart attack at 60 years old after not enjoying any of it because you made it all a business. Having a baby, make it a business. Anyway. This is our state of the union. Yeah, Speaker 2 (9:05) it's just that's where we're at. But I will I will I will bring this. What if you don't make it a business? What if you just live? Speaker 1 (9:15) What Speaker 2 (9:15) if Speaker 1 (9:16) you just sat in there and read something and then you didn't tell anyone about it? Speaker 2 (9:21) Well, actually, this is a great segue, I think, to some of my feelings about Steve Irwin. Tell Speaker 1 (9:27) me your feelings about Steve Irwin. That's what we're all here for. That's Speaker 2 (9:31) what we're here for. I will first I'll say that, you know, you're saying how all these media companies, they have this sinister idea of like they're going to try to figure out how to keep us on our phones and our screens 24 seven. And I can tell you that in reading about and immersing myself. in Crocodile Hunter media, ironically on a screen, I get it. But I actually have felt more inspired to be like, you know what? I need to like go outside and like try to identify. The plants and animals and things around me that I see every day, because that's probably what Steve Irwin would have done. And he would have been like... Speaker 1 (10:13) In the great state of Oregon that we should not build data centers in or anywhere for the love of God. Speaker 2 (10:18) Yeah, for the love of God, please. But I... Steve Irwin was just like, in a way, I know he had obviously this very popular show that aired on a TV, on a TV channel, but he really like his life was really about being... outside and getting obviously very up close and personal with wildlife, which is part of the sort of nuance to him. I, we started to say that I think whenever people, you know, they read the title of a you're wrong about episode and they're like, Oh no, what did. What did so-and-so do? I love that person. And I'm not here to take away anybody's feelings about Steve Irwin. I've come away still loving Steve Irwin. I think I just have a little bit more of a nuanced idea of him. Like he was a human being. Speaker 1 (11:05) Well, and you're approaching him as an adult, you know, and that maybe is inevitable, we hope. Yeah. Speaker 2 (11:10) Yeah. And, you know, none of us are above critique. Like there was things about his approach to his work that. People certainly were critiquing. But I think generally you're going to leave this episode still loving Steve Irwin. And I think he he still has a net positive on on the world. Thank Speaker 1 (11:32) you for reassuring people. Yeah. They're afraid of that. Can I tell you my like. Yes. You're wrong about many version of Steve Irwin. Yeah. Speaker 2 (11:39) We Speaker 1 (11:39) will then spend the rest of the episode complicating and correcting. OK. Speaker 2 (11:43) Yeah. Go for it. Speaker 1 (11:44) OK. This is what I. think I remember. In the early Speaker 2 (11:47) days Speaker 1 (11:47) of the show, we had a lot of reviews being like, I can't believe someone who doesn't even know anything about it is talking. And it was like, well, it's the point to not know about it originally. And we like, you know, have grown a lot around that, but it's to be like, oh, this is what I kind of remember. And then have someone tell you the correct version, which usually is pretty counter to the fossil version that you get Speaker 2 (12:06) through Speaker 1 (12:07) VH1 countdown shows and so on. Yeah. So, okay. So here's what I kind of remember is that I think there was a show on the Discovery Channel question mark called The Crocodile Hunter. And I believe that like the, I don't know, the promos and like the, maybe like the ads and the theme music for it. There was some element of Crocodile Hunter. Is that right? Something like that. Yeah. Don't make me look silly by saying I made that up by Speaker 2 (12:35) myself. Speaker 1 (12:37) But it was just like the show that was kind of like a phenomenon is, I guess, kind of an early reality show because I want to say it was on in like the late 90s into the 2000s, mid to late 90s. Yes. Yeah. But for like quite a while. And then it was about this guy named Steve Irwin, who was Australian. And Americans love Australians because we love to do an Australian accent. Although we refuse to ever hire a real Australian to do the ads for Outback Steakhouse. Please, for the love of all that is. blossoming in onions. Why can't we just get any of the millions of Australians living in LA and winning all of the Oscars to do this job? I probably talked about this on the show before. It makes me, I have had a vendetta against Outback Steakhouse since I was 10 years old because of this. And to say my investment in this, I, my dad grew up in New Zealand and subsequently Australia when he was a little bit older. And I grew up going to the Gold Coast to visit my grandparents, what feels like several summers in a row when I was like a tween. Oh, Speaker 2 (13:33) I didn't know that. Speaker 1 (13:34) Yeah. But not since then. So I have these tween age memories of it. Speaker 2 (13:40) Yeah. Oh, so if you were there as a tween, well, that was like right in the height of Crocodile Hunter. Here's what Speaker 1 (13:47) I remember. I remember annoying my relatives by listening to an album by Aqua that Barbie Girl was on, but like the whole album on like the family stereo. So whenever that was. Speaker 2 (14:06) But you don't have any memories of like Steve Irwin while you were in Australia at that time? Not that Speaker 1 (14:11) I can think of. I remember watching a lot of like, I mean, obviously it was, there was a lot of neighbors happening. Oh my gosh, yeah. I gotta get back over there. Because it's been this whole millennium since I've, and you have spent a lot of time in Australia and New Zealand as in your 20s for various reasons, some of them science related. Speaker 2 (14:33) Yeah, and I lived in, Australia for a little over a year and a half. I was first in Brisbane. That was my first six months. And then I actually went back to New Zealand for a bit. And then I went back to Australia and I was working in central Queensland and living in a town called Blackwater. It was a very odd place for me to end up. This was all because of a relationship with my ex that I ended up there. He and a bunch of friends were working at a coal mine. So Blackwater's in the middle of coal country in Queensland. You Speaker 1 (15:08) know what I love about this show is that there is someone listening who also ended up. living in a coal mining town because of a relationship that is now over, but probably a totally different coal mining town. Right. Speaker 2 (15:21) Yeah. Yeah. Because Speaker 1 (15:22) there's coal and X's all over the place. Speaker 2 (15:24) This is true. And every town, well, maybe not coal in every town, but there's certainly X's every town. I was working as an environmental officer, an enviro at the mine for a few months. I also worked as a jilaroo for like a month. Jilaroo is a cowgirl. And Yeah, I mean, I had I had amazing experiences there. It wasn't for me for the long term, but I really valued my time there. And it was just interesting diving into the Steve Irwin stuff because I was like, oh, yeah, I spent a lot of time in like places that I know he and his team were were in catching. I mean, not in central Queensland, but in far north Queensland. And just being in that environment and the kind of wildlife he would encounter and, you know, just some of the wildlife encounters I had, it just brought back a lot of memories, actually, of that time, which was actually kind of unexpected. And I think the other part of it, too, that I was not expecting to relate to so much was the fact that Terry Irwin, his wife. I don't know if you know this or remember this, Sarah, but she is from Eugene, Oregon. Speaker 1 (16:37) No, I didn't know that. Yeah. No, and I love finding out someone is from Oregon. This is amazing. She's from Oregon. She grew up in Eugene. And I Speaker 2 (16:47) just found myself relating to this story of her like coming to Australia and what it was like being a girl from Oregon in Australia. And yeah, there's a nice little tie in there. So, yeah, I guess all that's to say is that I think I think that Speaker 1 (17:02) hopefully less because of the way this show is as because of the way media is generally. I do. I think you're totally right that people have that fear that whenever we talk about someone on the show, it's like, oh, God, what do they do? Speaker 2 (17:14) And Speaker 1 (17:14) I think often what we're trying to do is to talk about someone and all of their complexity the best we can. And often we have the need to do that with someone gets flattened into kind of a media character, which can happen not because you did something bad, but just because. you had a lot of eyeballs on you and became like a character in the bigger culture for a while, which means by definition, like if you are an icon, an icon is like something that's easy to recognize that becomes kind of simplified, like a symbol or a hieroglyph, Speaker 2 (17:42) I think. Speaker 1 (17:43) And so with Steve Irwin, the idea with him was that he just was like, Americans think of Australians as being a little bit brainless, which I think is a bit rich coming from us, let's be honest. But we underestimate people because of the accent. It's the same thing with Southerners. And it's nice when no one can see you coming and when people underestimate you because of the way you talk in that sense. Yeah. And a lot of other accents and dialects. And of course, the way that like race and code switching play into all this, too. Right. Not to get too deep. But but so I think we all kind of saw Steve Irwin is like this happy go lucky guy who jumped around playing with large predators. And of course, he was called the Crocodile Hunter. And there was a South Park. parody of him as there is of every truly significant character of the 90s pretty much you know him being someone I think who just liked to go bother large animals but who also like was this very beloved very wholesome character who people like to watch and I think was someone who people like felt was part of a new wave of a new kind of tv but that didn't make you stressed about where all this was going. And then that he died to me very unexpectedly and tragically and also in a way that is, I think, extremely unusual and hard to foresee in 2006. And not to be so millennial that we make everything about ourselves, but I will point out that that was like the first week or so of college for both of us. And I really associate that with that like transition into adulthood. Yeah. Speaker 2 (19:14) No, Speaker 1 (19:15) absolutely. That was kind of unimaginable, you know, because he just seemed like very in his element doing this kind of thing all the time. Right. And then he died after an encounter with a stingray. Speaker 2 (19:27) Yeah. And it really and I remember feeling very like, I mean, obviously shocked and then emotional about it because my family loved. Steve Irwin. Speaker 1 (19:37) Oh, I didn't know this about you guys. Yeah, Speaker 2 (19:39) I think I got one of his DVDs for Christmas one year from my brother. And Speaker 1 (19:43) what was the show like? Because I don't think I ever watched it all that much. It was more like sort of when I was channel surfing kind of a thing. Speaker 2 (19:49) Yeah. Sometimes he's in Australia and he's maybe relocating a crocodile. So that was a big part of his career. Actually, before he started the show, he was a full time crocodile. catcher for the Queensland department. But Speaker 1 (20:07) of course, for American TV, we have to imply that he's killing them or else no one would be interested, as I assume, the meeting about this title, right? Speaker 2 (20:15) Well, I think it's more exciting to refer to him as the. crocodile hunter versus like catcher. It just sounds more dramatic. And I but I think also people tend to give the caveat of like, well, hunter can also mean you're just looking for something. It doesn't mean you have to kill it. That's true. Speaker 1 (20:32) Right. Like I'm Speaker 2 (20:32) hunting for my glasses. Right. The glasses Speaker 1 (20:35) hunter. Yeah. Speaker 2 (20:36) Yeah. Speaker 1 (20:37) However, I do think that that is like revealing of what we we think people want. It never to me gave the impression that he was safely relocating. These animals. I mean, I didn't think that he was killing them either, but I understood that it meant he was like looking for them and then he would find them and be like, hey. Right. You know, but I didn't realize that there was that we were helping the crocodiles. Why did he have to move them? How did they get where they weren't supposed to be? Are they just doing that a lot? So Speaker 2 (21:02) maybe it helps if I like kind of take a step back in his life, if we like started at the beginning, a very good place to start. And yeah, Speaker 1 (21:10) just like in Dune. Speaker 2 (21:12) So he he was born in 1962. He has. Two sisters and his parents, Bob and Lynn. He was very close with his parents growing up. He grew up first in Victoria near Melbourne. And he was born on his mother's birthday. And he was always very, very close with his mom. And I think that kind of intensified, you know, how close they were was the fact that they shared a birthday. Speaker 1 (21:38) And Speaker 2 (21:38) his sisters, I don't know. He like, there's hardly any mention of them. They did come to work. at the zoo later on, but otherwise I don't really find much about them mentioned anywhere. And then he and his parents were really passionate about reptiles specifically, like in the sense that they really, I guess at the time, liked to collect them and keep them as pets sort of thing. This was just in their own home. They were, I believe, also... rehabilitating wildlife as well. Steve Irwin talks about how his mom was always nursing kangaroo joeys. And that is quite a frequent thing in Australia is wildlife like kangaroos or wombats, marsupials that are hit by a car. And the joey survives if there is a joey. Oh, yeah. And so they actually there is encouragement. If you hit and kill a kangaroo to check the pouch and make sure that there's not a Joey in there. Speaker 1 (22:46) God, does this happen to people like on the way to weddings and stuff? You know, you're just minding your business. And then are kangaroo like deer in this way? Yes. Man, I didn't know that. Speaker 2 (22:57) That is my analogy. I don't. Well, why would I think I would know that? Speaker 1 (23:01) I wasn't driving when I was 11 years old. Nor are there probably that many kangaroos on the Gold Coast and the part where all the slot machines are. Speaker 2 (23:08) Yes, exactly. Yeah. No, it depends on where you are. You can certainly visit Speaker 1 (23:12) Australia and never see a wild kangaroo. Right. Like if you're in New York City, you're not going to hit a deer. If you're in upstate New York, deer hit you. Speaker 2 (23:20) Yeah. But I yeah, they are very frequent. Speaker 1 (23:25) Wait, but if you hit a kangaroo and you kill it and there's a joey inside, like, what do you do then? Do you like wrap it up in a towel and take it to a wildlife rehab center? Is there a plan? Speaker 2 (23:34) Yeah, I think generally that's the idea. And I believe you can also get certified to be like a wildlife. rehabilitator in your own home to like through the government, you know, relevant government departments. You can run a Speaker 1 (23:50) Joey clinic. Speaker 2 (23:51) Yeah. I do remember looking into this when I was in Australia. I was like, Oh, that would be, that would be cool. I would love to do that. And that's basically what yeah. Steve Irwin's mom, Lynn Irwin was, was doing. Um, she was sort of nursing animals back to health. And so it was just a family that was very passionate about wildlife. Speaker 1 (24:10) What kind of animals does he grow up with around the house? Speaker 2 (24:13) Well, so a good story about this is Steve received his first reptile when he was six years old, like on his birthday. It was like Speaker 1 (24:25) a birthday gift. That's nice. And you Speaker 2 (24:26) might think like, oh, his parents gave him like the Australian equivalent of a garter snake or something like that. But no, he got in true Steve Irwin fashion. He got a. 12 foot scrub python. Like that was what his parents gave him. But they had the sense to be like, you can't play with him. He is yours, but you like can't play with him because he will probably actually eat you because you're a six year old boy and you're actually smaller than him. The Speaker 1 (24:54) ratio of snake to owner in pounds has to be really high. Yeah, Speaker 2 (24:59) right. And to be Speaker 1 (25:00) clear, like I love snakes and I think they're really cool. And I do Speaker 2 (25:04) too. Speaker 1 (25:05) Nothing against the Irwins. It's just it's these are animals that like you need to contain effectively and like they definitely aren't harmless. And all that is to say that we're probably going to be spending a lot of time with this theme of like responsible interaction with potentially dangerous animals being about respecting. Exactly. Who and what they are and also not over identifying with them. And I feel I have a sense that this is going to be a tale of someone doing that pretty successfully. Yeah, Speaker 2 (25:32) you're right on it. Sarah, that is basically the theme of kind of the nuance of Steve Irwin's life. Because yeah, when I was reading about this, I was like, oh, that's interesting. Like, I'm trying to think of like, if I met some people that were keeping a bunch of reptiles in their own home and other animals, there would be a part of me that'd be like, is this a good idea? Like, are you guys, do you guys actually know what you're doing? And I do think that Irwin's... I think they did have a healthy respect for the predators that they took care of. So like another story that I guess is emblematic of this is when Steve Irwin was seven years old, he and his dad went out in Northern Victoria and they were just looking for snakes, as you do. And it was a little confusing to me as whether they were looking for snakes to collect or just to look at or whatever it was. Steve was a little kid. He said he was playing war. He's like stalking his dad and like pretending a stick as a gun or whatever. And he's just being a little boy. And Speaker 1 (26:39) he stepped on a snake and he pinned it down with his foot. Speaker 2 (26:45) And he was so excited. He Speaker 1 (26:47) called Speaker 2 (26:47) his dad over and he's like, look, dad, I caught a snake. And the dad looks at the snake and he like. pushes steve like really abruptly oh boy steve describes it as like he like knocked him back with his forearm and also yells you bloody idiot which is like oh okay poor baby steve and i'll read a quote he said the pain from my injuries from his dad knocking him over disappeared as the pain from his anger crushed me like a bug but dad I whimpered. My heart was broken. My pride had turned into an overwhelming sense of confusion and embarrassment. Bursting into uncontrollable state of crying, I ran off down the rocks. I ran and ran, bawling my eyes out. Finally, I had to stop running. As I was crying so hard, I couldn't get my breath. I was sobbing so much. My breathing was impaired and I didn't know what to do. I'm like, oh my gosh. So I think the way his dad reacted, like really? scared him, obviously. But Speaker 1 (27:49) here's the Speaker 2 (27:50) thing. That Speaker 1 (27:51) snake was Speaker 2 (27:52) a brown snake. They are the second most venomous snake in the world. Can Speaker 1 (27:58) you Speaker 2 (27:59) imagine as a parent, if your kid's like, look what I found. And it's literally the second most venomous snake in the world. You might say something that you would regret later, but. Speaker 1 (28:11) So, yeah, at that point, like you're not really thinking your gut is sort of taking over. And the phrase you bloody idiot might come out of your mouth before you really are thinking about anything. Speaker 2 (28:21) Yeah, yeah, exactly. I just thought that was a I thought it was an interesting story. And then actually the sort of button to that story is that Steve runs off and he's, you know, really upset and goes down to the river and he's like, I'm going to run away from home and I'm just going to live out here. And he finds a little cave and like he immediately just starts looking for lizards. And I think it just like immediately turns his mood around. And then he hears his dad calling for him out in the bush. And as he's like, OK, I got to go. He says goodbye, little lizards. And he went back to the car, which I just find really sweet. I really like that. I know. Goodbye, little lizards. So he just always loved wildlife. And I think honestly, I mean, I think every kid loves animals and loves wildlife. And I'm sure Steve Irwin, like he had a very heightened kind of love of wildlife. But also his parents really encouraged it and nurtured that passion about wildlife from a very young age. But I think like him saying goodbye little lizards to the... I think they were Cunningham's skinks is what he found. But he, Speaker 1 (29:38) I Speaker 2 (29:38) think that's Speaker 1 (29:39) the Speaker 2 (29:39) way that a lot of kids talk to animals. Yeah. They talk to them in a very empathetic and caring and just warm way. And I think the thing that people love about Steve Irwin is he just never stopped doing that. Like as he got older, I mean, he, obviously there was the crocodile catching aspect and it's very like. it's framed in the show very much as like, I'm a man off to catch this dangerous crocodile. Yeah. Speaker 1 (30:08) And it's like produced and edited that way, I think, because I imagine because there's a sense of like, well, this is kind of, you know, yeah, what you're saying, the kind of like emphasizing the 90s masculinity of it, I guess. Right. Speaker 2 (30:22) Yeah. But, you know, when he kind of takes a beat and he's. kind of slowing down and he's just talking about an animal, he really does have that warmth. And he just, you genuinely believe, and I think it is genuine on his part, that he loves like every animal that Speaker 1 (30:42) he encounters and thinks they're like the most amazing Speaker 2 (30:45) thing in the world. And he knows, you know, all these really cool, interesting facts. I do like that part of him was very authentic. And I think that was part of his appeal was that he just brought that kind of childlike wonder through and shared it with people and people really responded to it. Anyway, so he like he and his family, eventually they move from Victoria to Queensland and his parents buy a piece of property. Because they realized, oh, we have all of these animals. We need somewhere to keep them. Also, we're kind of interested in starting a zoo, basically. So they opened the Birwa Reptile Park. And this is along the Bruce Highway, along the Sunshine Coast. It's the same place that the Australia Zoo is today. They opened it in 1970. It started with just four acres. Speaker 2 (31:43) I guess, primarily had reptiles. I don't, they may have had like, I think maybe his mom was still like doing a lot of like kangaroo and wombat and other marsupials and other mammal rehabilitation, but primarily a reptile park. And his dad, Bob Irwin, he kind of built it from the ground up. And then in the 1980s, the family. We're still running this park, but it became the Queensland Reptile and Fauna Park in 1980. And about this time is when Steve and his dad, Bob, got serious about rescuing crocodiles. So crocodiles in Australia. And I just want to say, actually, I meant