When Rebrands Go Wrong

VinePair Podcast

The hosts discuss the significant risks associated with rebranding and repackaging established consumer goods, specifically focusing on Highlan

Key takeaways

• Highland Park's transition from a black label to a white label risks making the brand appear as a 'Macallan clone'.
• Changing packaging is often a low-cost, high-risk attempt by brand managers to leave a personal 'fingerprint' on a brand.

Main topics

• Highland Park rebranding
• Consumer recognition and psychology

Notable quotes

The only time it seems to me to make sense to change the packaging is if the brand isn't succeeding.

Conclusion

Successful branding relies on maintaining the visual contract with loy

Transcript preview

Speaker 3 (0:18) From VinePair's New Speaker 2 (0:19) York City headquarters, I'm Adam Teter. Speaker 1 (0:21) And I'm Joanna Sherino. Speaker 2 (0:22) And in Seattle, Washington, I'm Zach Jabal. This, this right here is the Speaker 3 (0:27) VinePair podcast. Speaker 1 (0:28) I Speaker 3 (0:29) had to do something different, you know? Yeah. We're complete. Yeah. I know. No one's sick. No one's on vacation. I hope people Speaker 1 (0:35) can hear that I was sick, though. No, I don't think you want to, Speaker 3 (0:38) like, have the remnant. No, I want to justify my Speaker 1 (0:40) absence. Speaker 3 (0:40) I need everyone to know. Justify my absence. No, because I Speaker 1 (0:45) have to say, none of us really take sick days from the podcast. We Speaker 3 (0:48) don't. Speaker 1 (0:48) We really don't. So I felt a lot of guilt. this past week being like, I cannot Speaker 3 (0:53) come in. I gotta say, I was actually shocked that we didn't get a slack from you right before recording. Like, hey guys, I have my mic set up at home and I can still do this. Speaker 1 (1:00) Well, when I tried to go in in the morning, Evan was like, what are you doing? And I was like, no, I gotta go in. I got the podcast. And he was like, you're gonna look like shit on the podcast. And I was like, okay, fair enough. I do think the video component has changed the game. Speaker 2 (1:14) There have definitely been one or two times where in the pre-video era, I... I was probably podcasting at 70%, but you can only sort of tell that with the audio. It's much more obvious with the video. You're Speaker 3 (1:24) like, Speaker 2 (1:24) oh, wow. Speaker 1 (1:26) They Speaker 3 (1:26) look pale. Speaker 1 (1:27) Is Speaker 3 (1:28) she Speaker 1 (1:28) sweating? Speaker 3 (1:30) Get some color in those cheeks. Speaker 2 (1:32) Anyway. Joanna, what cold remedies have you been drinking? Hot toddies? Speaker 1 (1:40) No, I don't do that. Speaker 3 (1:42) I Speaker 1 (1:43) don't do that. Yeah, I don't. I can't remember much of what I drank this past weekend before I got sick, but we did have, I had a pour of the limited edition Dewars. Evan sent me a picture of it because I couldn't remember what it was. I'm Speaker 3 (1:59) sorry, but there's something real tater about I had a pour. I Speaker 1 (2:02) had a pour? Speaker 3 (2:03) I just feel like when you say I had a pour of. Has the Speaker 1 (2:05) language seeped into my vocabulary? That's real tater-esque, right? If Speaker 3 (2:08) you ask anyone, the people who I know who are taters are always like, you want a pour of this? You want a pour? You want a pour? I don't have a glass. How about a tipple? A dram? I had a Speaker 1 (2:17) finger or a dram worse. Just say you had a glass of. I had a cup of. A full Speaker 3 (2:24) eight fluid ounces of. Speaker 1 (2:26) Yeah. Limited distillery edition, which was their like rested in Cabernet Sauvignon barrels. You Speaker 3 (2:33) brought this Speaker 1 (2:33) home Speaker 3 (2:33) from Scotland? Speaker 1 (2:34) Yeah, we brought it home. So that was really great. And just our regular martinis that we typically have on a Friday. Nice. Speaker 3 (2:42) I love this tradition for you. Speaker 1 (2:44) It's, yeah, I don't know. I just like, I feel like we all do this. It's great. It's not really exciting or, you know, much to talk about, but it's just like, it hits. It's Speaker 3 (2:54) a nice way to start the weekend. I don't know. I've always liked other cocktails, but like the martini, for whatever reason, I think that's why it's also having a moment, is both beautifully simplistic and also complex. And just, yeah, there's a weird sort of romanticism to how you make it. Also, it's the only cocktail that I've ever made when I have dinner parties, too, where, like, no one says no to one. Speaker 2 (3:20) No Speaker 3 (3:20) one's like, no, no, no, I don't want a martini. Because I'll usually at least say, like, do you want vodka or gin? But no one's like, no, no, I don't drink martinis. I don't like martinis. Speaker 1 (3:27) Yeah. Nobody who's coming over to your house, usually. Speaker 3 (3:30) Well, they're not allowed. Speaker 2 (3:31) My argument is that perhaps it's the most adult of cocktails. Like, you just, it's just like there's no, yeah, there's very little else to it. Obviously, it is complex. And also, in a way, as you said, simple. But, like, I just think it has that air of, like, it just, not even sophistication, because I think other cocktails can match it for sort of that piece. But there's just, like, you can't, I mean, you can't imagine someone who's not a grown-up enjoying that drink. Speaker 3 (3:58) Yeah. Unless, oh, I'm sorry, you need some sugar, you little baby. Well, Speaker 1 (4:01) yeah. For me, it's like a flavor profile thing, right? Like, we went through, like, I used to be a... I mean, I still really enjoy Manhattans or Negronis. Like, we will have those as well. But it's more about, like, do I want that flavor and sweetness and bitterness? Yeah. And it's, I typically just, there's nothing else that really offers what a martini offers in terms of, like, savoriness. I Speaker 3 (4:23) find I only really crave a Manhattan in the winter. Like, when it's cold, I will crave brown cocktails in general. But, and then for Negronis, too, like, I'll crave them every once in a while. I'll be like, oh, I'd like a Negroni. Or like when we travel, especially to Europe, it's a very safe cocktail order. Right. I found. Right. Much safer than the Martini order. Right. Like much safer. It's definitely the more ubiquitous, every hotel, whatever in Europe knows how to make a Negroni. It's made the rounds. And Speaker 2 (4:55) there's not a brand of vermouth called Negroni that Speaker 3 (4:57) it gets confused for. Speaker 2 (4:58) But like, Speaker 3 (4:59) yeah, Speaker 2 (4:59) but I agree. The Martini is the one that's like, Speaker 3 (5:01) yeah, I totally Speaker 2 (5:02) will have one. Like, you've got that. I'll totally have it. Speaker 3 (5:05) Yeah. Speaker 2 (5:06) Yeah. Speaker 1 (5:06) Great. That's nice. What Speaker 2 (5:08) about you, Zach? So I got to feel a little bit like a hypocrite, which is always fun. Nice. Yeah. After we kind of shat on wine collecting and all that stuff, which, you know, to be fair, I did. You collected Speaker 3 (5:17) more. I Speaker 2 (5:18) did while sitting amongst several hundred bottles of wine and whatnot and spirits, et cetera. But I did have the opportunity the other day to open a bottle from said collection, which was a 2014 Syrah from Gramercy Cellars here in Washington. And, you know, like Caitlin and I just sold. Yeah, they Speaker 1 (5:34) just sold, right? Speaker 2 (5:35) Yes, they did just sell. Look at you guys on top of the Washington wine industry. This was from well before that and before other things in their history, which I won't get into in this moment. Right. Yeah. In any case, we sometimes this will happen and I'm sure it happens with the both of you where you'll be at home or at a restaurant or whatever. And like you'll get a bottle of wine, open a bottle of wine, whatever, pour it. And like you and your spouse will just have that moment where you're looking like, fuck, this is really good. God Speaker 3 (6:00) damn it. This is my fucking story that I was going to say for my shit. This is bullshit. Like, I literally had this exact experience that I was going to fucking talk about. Well, you tell Speaker 1 (6:12) the Naomi story where it's like, there's a bottle every once in a while where you pour it for Speaker 3 (6:17) Naomi. This Speaker 1 (6:17) just happened to everyone. Fuck off, Speaker 2 (6:19) Zach. Keep talking. Well, hopefully it wasn't the same wine. That would be really pretty shocking. Although it was a great bottle. I will leave it there. Please, Adam, continue. Speaker 3 (6:28) Okay, what have I been drinking? Well, first, before I get to the story, there needs to be some separation. Speaker 1 (6:33) Yeah, sure, sure. Speaker 3 (6:34) So this tradition is a tradition Naomi's grandmother always did, and then Naomi and I have kept it because I didn't ever spend break fast with my grandparents because they were in Florida and whatever, and so we'd go to something in the community or whatever. But when we moved to New York and Naomi's grandmother was still alive on Long Island, we would go out there. And they had this incredible tradition when they would break the fast for Yom Kippur where like no matter who you were, Speaker 1 (6:59) you Speaker 3 (7:00) took a vodka shot. Speaker 1 (7:01) Oh, fun. Speaker 3 (7:01) Also, it's always really my family, her family too, like Jews, non-Jews, like everyone comes over. So we had this like event on Monday night that ballooned into 22 people because of people being like, what are you doing? What are you doing? And so we had all these people at our house. It was really nice. And I pulled this bottle of vodka out of the freezer and explained this tradition. And everyone was in. Like, it was amazing. And it's Speaker 2 (7:26) a Speaker 3 (7:26) Monday night, right? And, like, we're taking vodka shots and, like, eating pickles. And, I mean, I think Naomi's grandmother was Hungarian, so maybe this comes from there. But it was, like, it's really fun and, like, a way that makes the end of, like, the high holidays feel really special and stuff. So that was really fun. And I wish I could tell you what the vodka was, but. I was going to Speaker 1 (7:46) ask. Speaker 3 (7:46) So I know it. It's the super high-end vodka. Speaker 1 (7:51) Chopin. Speaker 3 (7:52) Yeah, Chopin. Chopin's like, I forget what it's called. It was like a bottle that, so that's what I took home. Nice. And it's fun. So also when you shoot a vodka like that and it's coming out of the freezer, everyone's like, this is so easy and delicious. So that was fun. And then now my experience. Speaker 1 (8:06) This Speaker 3 (8:06) last weekend, we went to go visit our friends who, it was their birthday weekend and they have like a house up in Connecticut. Speaker 1 (8:15) So Speaker 3 (8:16) we went to go see them and. I got to do this thing that I rarely find it possible to do in New York anymore, which is we were driving through this tiny town to get what they had been told are like the best breakfast sandwiches, which were good. I say the reason they were good and why I'm pro this is it was a bacon, egg, and cheese. But the thing they do up there, which I think people in New York would flip the fuck out about, is they put mayonnaise on it. Or aioli. It makes it creamier. It's better. I'm sorry. This whole like raw dog and a bacon, egg, and cheese with nothing on the bread but bacon, egg, and cheese is a fool's errand. Like you've got to – and I don't know ketchup. Like I think like a garlic aioli and – whatever. So that was what made it a good sandwich. And then we drove by this like tiny liquor store and I was going to make Palomas because this is – Because this is Jess's favorite cocktail. Okay. Whose birthday it was. Okay. So I was Speaker 1 (9:09) like Speaker 3 (9:09) I'll make Palomas. for like the cocktail before dinner. And we went in and as luck would have it, my child had to go to the bathroom. Sure. Number two. Great. Speaker 1 (9:18) So Speaker 3 (9:18) that takes a while, right? So Naomi's in there with her and I- In the Speaker 1 (9:21) liquor store. Speaker 3 (9:22) Yeah. Just pooping in the liquor store. Because it was a kid, they were like, but Naomi was like, do you have a bathroom? And they're like, no. And then Naomi, and then Estee goes, mommy, I really have to go. And Speaker 1 (9:32) they Speaker 3 (9:32) go, oh, it's for her. Yeah, we have one. Like it was so Speaker 1 (9:34) funny. Oh, that's nice. That's lucky. Yeah, Speaker 3 (9:36) I was like, no, no, no, we have one. Speaker 1 (9:37) Yeah. Speaker 3 (9:38) And so- I started just like perusing and I started digging, Speaker 1 (9:42) which Speaker 3 (9:43) I haven't gotten to do in a long time. It's so Speaker 1 (9:45) fun to dig through like a random liquor store and see what they have. It's my favorite thing. Speaker 3 (9:50) I found this bottle of 2016 Gemme that was from a pretty well-known producer. I didn't take a picture of the label, but I recognized the producer and there was no price on the bottle. Speaker 1 (10:01) Oh, Speaker 3 (10:01) I'm shocked Speaker 1 (10:03) they had this. Speaker 3 (10:04) So they had a bunch of brands. They had some stuff. Speaker 1 (10:06) Oh, sorry. You're in Connecticut? In Connecticut. Okay. Speaker 3 (10:08) But they had like some stuff from like, I saw some polliner wine, some, people, whoever, someone's been buying stuff. I mean, look, look, it's Connecticut. We're close to Washington, Connecticut. It's like, it was a liquor store for sure. Yeah. Speaker 1 (10:21) But Speaker 3 (10:21) like, it's a bougie area. So like, they definitely had people that came through there. So it's like at the bottom of this bin and I pull it out and I take it to the register and she's like, I don't know how much