Joanna Robinson On Netflix’s Increasing UK Presence, Sharon Horgan’s ‘Youth,’ and ‘Slow Horses’ Season 6, Episode 2.

The Watch

Hosts Chris Ryan and Joanna Robinson discuss the evolving landscape of television, focusing on Netflix UK's recent upfront announcements and t

Key takeaways

• Netflix UK is prioritizing prestige drama with new titles like 'Witch Hunt' and 'Black Doves' related projects.
• The expansion of 'The Beast in Me' from a limited series to a second season is criticized as an attempt to circumvent Emmy rules.
• Streaming services, specifically Disney Plus, are reaching a price ceiling that may alienate regular subscribers.
• Sharon Horgan's 'Youth' is highlighted as high-quality 'low concept' television exploring the 'sandwich generation'.
• The hosts contrast 'critical hive mind' TV rankings with personal favorites like 'Lost' and 'The Wire'.

Main topics

• Netflix UK Upfronts
• Streaming Subscription Price Hikes
• Sharon Horgan's 'Youth'

Notable quotes

This is bullshit. This is horrible.

Conclusion

A deep dive into how industry business decisions and award politics ar

Transcript preview

Speaker 2 (0:05) I need supports to have to clear the room. Speaker 1 (0:08) Stand up and walk now. Speaker 2 (0:10) Hello and welcome to The Watch. My name is Chris Ryan. I am an editor at TheRigger.com. Joining me in the studio, her season one Speaker 1 (0:19) demise was greatly exaggerated. It's Joanna Robinson! It's series one, Chris. Speaker 2 (0:26) Series one. You're right. Well, this is a very Anglophilic pod today, Joe. Thank you for joining me. Andy is out today. We have some news at the top. We're going to talk about Sharon Horgan's new show. I don't know why I seem to pronounce that with like... Two R's and an I in Horgan, but I'm like... Just Speaker 1 (0:42) to make sure people know she's Irish. Speaker 2 (0:44) Yeah, exactly. Sharon Horgan's new show, Youth, the first two episodes of which are up on HBO. We're going to talk a little bit about Slow Horses. We're going to talk a little bit about the unfolding New York Times Best of the Century list for TV, which we contributed to. And it's like, as we're recording, I think they've revealed up to 20, I Speaker 1 (1:04) believe. Speaker 2 (1:05) I like that. And Speaker 1 (1:06) all I know is Andor's 32, which... Too low for Andor. Speaker 2 (1:09) Well, I'm sure we have some common ground. We have some diversions. I wanted to talk to you about the act of list making in general, but some news at the top. First of all, how are you doing? Speaker 1 (1:17) I'm great. Here's my question about today. Is this our soft launch for Ringer UK? Where you and I move to the UK and just talk about British television. You know, Speaker 2 (1:27) over the years, every time I start to work up the courage to really interrogate it, they get a new prime minister. And I'm like, let's see how this one works out. You know, so like. I, uh, I'm, I'm pretty fired up about Burnham, Burnmentum. I'm feeling the burn. Uh, yeah. And, and yet, you know, by the time I, I start packing my bags, I'm going to go in November. So hopefully we're Speaker 1 (1:50) both going in November. Speaker 2 (1:51) Yossi's going in November. Yeah. Didn't Yossi Speaker 1 (1:54) just get back from that? Speaker 2 (1:55) Like, this is... Okay, we're UK. Speaker 1 (1:57) Richard Osman, we're coming for your job. That's right. That's Speaker 2 (1:59) what Speaker 1 (1:59) I have to say. Speaker 2 (2:00) Which one of his jobs? Writing cozy mysteries? Yeah, cozy mysteries. Hosting a pod with Marina Hirsch, you know? Speaking of England, speaking of... British TV, which we generally really like and has had such a profound impact on the way that American TV, I think, is made and received. Especially Speaker 1 (2:17) right now. It's part Speaker 2 (2:18) of the internationalization, the globalization of television. They did an upfront, sort of showing their wares for Netflix UK, which was of special interest to me because I am of the opinion that a lot of their shows from this sort of region and this... Department of Netflix have been kind of keeping some of their prestige efforts afloat Adolescents Speaker 1 (2:43) and baby reindeer. Yeah, Speaker 2 (2:45) and and even stuff like black doves, which certainly will entertain your John wick fans sure I think has a lot of weight to it and and Joe Barton is a great writer and I really like can't wait for this to come back so I can run down sort of the big announcements Netflix UK Speaker 2 (3:05) Witch Hunt, which is a dark drama. And these are log lines I'm taking from Deadline. A dark drama about a modern day witch hunt starring Sarah Glankisher, written by Abby Morgan. And you say what? Speaker 1 (3:18) Could not be more for me. This Speaker 2 (3:20) is I'm really glad you're here. These are. These are just for me. Are Speaker 1 (3:24) they not? Did they not say, here are three shows for you, Joanna Robinson? Yes. A witch show, Sarah Lancashire, an icon. Yeah. We are going to talk about the New York Times list, but I don't know if you did this. Something I did is I, when I was looking at the sort of like various luminaries who had made their lists, I was playing a game where I would like look at the list and try to guess like kind of who the person was. Oh, that's fucking smart. And, Speaker 2 (3:46) you know, Speaker 1 (3:46) I was like, oh, this is, and, you know, you can tell who's from the UK if they have Happy Valley on their list. Happy Valley was the most, I would say, represented UK show from what I saw. Yes. If you Speaker 2 (3:56) were involved in one side or the other of Brexit. Yeah. You love Happy Valley. Speaker 1 (4:01) So, Sarah Lancashire, an icon for a number of shows. And then Abby Morgan. I mean, honestly, if. the hour had been allowed to end on its own terms, it would have been on my list, on my top 10 list. I love that. Speaker 2 (4:16) I'm going to check you soon because I think you're going to start saying things like that. And then you're all of a sudden going to have 63 shows in your top 10 Speaker 1 (4:24) list. Speaker 2 (4:24) Had there just been one. I Speaker 1 (4:26) mean, but that's true. What can you say? There's so much great television. I didn't love her last endeavor, The Cumberbatch Show. Yeah, I wasn't a huge fan. But it's a witch show. Yeah. Chris, like an actual witch show. And Speaker 2 (4:40) Sarah Lancashire currently kind of a relief pitcher on Black Doves. Comes on for like, I don't know, like a dozen scenes a year or something like that. The Margo Martindale of Speaker 1 (4:50) the American sort of role. Yeah. Speaker 2 (4:52) And she's great on that. But it's cool to have her back in a leading role and paired with Abby Morgan. Witch Hunt sounds really cool. The other one that leapt off this page to me was Black Mirror, which is not Black Mirror. but Black Mirror, but it is from Charlie Brooker. Speaker 1 (5:10) What's the name of the fictional town? Is it like Bleakshire? It's Speaker 2 (5:13) like it. So this is a very serious, quote unquote, a very serious crime thriller that takes a satirical look at serious crime thrillers. So I think it's supposed to be functioning on two levels. It is essentially like a I don't know if it's how lightly it's lampooning shows like Broadchurch. and shows these Nordic wars that I love and you love. But Patti Considine is starring with Rory Kinnear and Georgina Campbell. And this is coming in early 27. And it was interesting even the way that they described this in the Deadline.com article where it was going to be airing after Black Doves as if it was almost a like they were thinking through the programming of them. black Speaker 1 (5:57) doves into black mare yeah Speaker 2 (5:59) but like in a sense like the way the hbo kind of programs like will lead you for eight weeks through lanterns and then after lanterns you know war will come on there's Speaker 1 (6:08) always something on hbo sunday exactly and Speaker 2 (6:09) i wonder There are a lot of different divisions of Netflix and a lot of different divisions of Netflix programming. And the fact that they're just like, if you were to watch one episode of Black Doves a week, people won't do that. They will watch it in a weekend or over the course of a week. But if you wanted to watch one episode of Black Doves a week, it would take you right up to when we're releasing Black Mirror. But Speaker 1 (6:30) to your point, that's so hard to do in the binge culture because they don't know when people are watching their shows and we don't know how to cover their shows because we don't know when people Speaker 2 (6:37) are watching their shows. Speaker 1 (6:37) This Speaker 2 (6:37) is like me telling myself that I will look at Instagram for 10 minutes a day and just respond to some DMs. No, it's terrible. Speaker 1 (6:45) It's awful. Speaker 2 (6:46) I have so many half-started sweet potato dishes and cats that I'm stalking and stuff like that. I'm all up on this. This lesbian bar drama in the Western Massachusetts is just terrible. Speaker 1 (6:59) Can I say the lesbian bar drama has been the joy of my life. It's rocked Speaker 2 (7:03) our household. How are the Speaker 1 (7:06) milk takes for Speaker 2 (7:06) you? Well, on Instagram or. Oh, the milk it takes? The milk adjacent Speaker 1 (7:10) takes? Speaker 2 (7:11) Oh, yes. I mean, like, this is rocked Speaker 1 (7:14) our Speaker 2 (7:14) house deeper than any story I can't even think of until the last time we've been as captivated. Phoebe did Speaker 1 (7:21) text me about it this morning. It was very special. We haven't even Speaker 2 (7:24) started discussing my dating history in Western Massachusetts, which is not legion, but is... But Speaker 1 (7:30) do you think it touches clowns? You know, I don't know. Okay. We can't be sure. I may have to go Speaker 2 (7:36) and do some on the ground reporting. Oh, it's on the ground. Yeah. Speaker 1 (7:39) Okay. Masked up, obviously. No other way. Speaker 2 (7:44) So if people don't know, Boston Globe published an article about a lesbian community in Western Massachusetts that was, you know, very centered around a bar that had been there where they were very COVID conscious to this day. And you know what? It turns out that the comment section just. blew itself up and this this bar has kind of fallen apart the community has fallen apart over over a lot of stuff it's really got to read it to believe Speaker 1 (8:11) like twitter hasn't been this good in so long and also did you see the Boston Globe said this was their most trafficked article in what like a decade which is depressing my gateway Speaker 2 (8:20) to it was everybody making spotlight memes about the COVID conscious lesbian bar in western Massachusetts and Mark Ruffalo being like Speaker 1 (8:27) they knew Robbie that's my favorite of the tweets that's the best one um Speaker 2 (8:33) god damn It's just the internet. So that's how did we get on to Western Massachusetts lesbians? I don't know. Instagram. Oh, when I tell myself that a Speaker 1 (8:42) clock for myself as to when we would talk. Yeah. Speaker 2 (8:45) When I when I'm like, oh, I'm just going to watch one. If I like the show, it's just there's nothing better. I'm I have to hold myself back usually when I have screeners and stuff to like blow to not blow through them. Yeah. I'm not good at, you know, and I did. I just did that with youth where I was like, no, watch it with the people. Don't have like a, nope, see? Speaker 1 (9:05) I ruined myself. Speaker 2 (9:06) You are a real enabler when it comes to this. It's Speaker 1 (9:10) true. Speaker 2 (9:11) You're the queen of, hey, if you checked out East of Eden, I've watched it. I've watched all of it. Speaker 1 (9:17) The problem with youth or even something like Furious. If they put a will they won't they in there, it's really hard for me to stop. You know, and if part of the will they won't they is Rupert Friend with a Scottish accent, then I have a really difficult time stopping. Speaker 2 (9:31) The other show that Netflix UK announced was Hot or Cold. And this is. This is, again, like if you were going to say Sarah Lancashire and Abby Morgan making a witch drama, the opposite side of that coin, but still beloved by Joe, would be a new comedy entertainment format and challenge-based game show led by British comedians Bob Mortimer and Richard Ayoade. I Speaker 1 (9:55) mean, Richard Ayoade and Bob Mortimer are two of my favorites of all time. This is like drafting off of Taskmaster. Richard Ayoade on the current season of Taskmaster, absolutely crushing Speaker 2 (10:05) it. Speaker 1 (10:05) And what's the name of the Speaker 2 (10:05) show where they can't laugh? Speaker 1 (10:07) Oh, Last One Laughing UK. Yeah, Speaker 2 (10:09) of Speaker 1 (10:09) course. They're both... Bob won the first series. Spoilers. Spoilers for that. The Speaker 2 (10:14) most absurd show I've ever seen. Speaker 1 (10:16) The fact that there are tasks and challenges involved is very Taskmaster. And they said an all-star cast of comedians, but they haven't announced who, so I can't wait to see who the contestants are. Yeah. This is so for me. This is great. Speaker 2 (10:32) I mean, Speaker 1 (10:32) this is just wonderful. It's interesting to me. It's Speaker 2 (10:35) kind of like... What these guys do, so Taskmaster, I think you can watch on Amazon Prime in some capacity. It's all on YouTube. And Last One Laughing, you can watch on Prime. I would say that for people who aren't familiar with what we're talking about, this is a comedian, a comic version of British Bake Off. It's so cozy to watch it. These shows are so warm, even though they're... sometimes spiky and sometimes like irreverent and absurd that I just feel like, like it levels out my heart rate at the end of the day. We've Speaker 1 (11:09) talked about this before, how just UK panel shows, which, you know, include Taskmaster or What I Lie to You, or there's just like a number of versions, is just my most comfort YouTube rewatch situation. It's why. spoiler, Taskmaster landed on my top 10 of New York Times TV list, which is insane. But like I had to have Taskmaster on Speaker 2 (11:29) it. Speaker 1 (11:29) I Speaker 2 (11:29) have Speaker 1 (11:29) an Speaker 2 (11:29) unscripted one of mine as well. Yeah, but Speaker 1 (11:30) yours is more prestigious than mine, I think. But I think that it's so interesting to me to have these upfronts, which have to be, first of all, thank you so much to Netflix and the UK in general for making these three shows just for me. I had not said Black Mirror out loud to myself. It's very hard. Well, the fact that it is Black Mirror, but Black Mirror is Speaker 2 (11:50) really... I Speaker 1 (11:50) hope it's Black Mare. Black Mare. Black Mare. But Adolescence and Baby Reindeer being such an explosive, positive thing for them has to be the reason why we're getting such a, like, a splashy announcement for something like this, do you think? Speaker 2 (12:05) I wonder whether or not, you know, because Andy has talked about Netflix's efforts to kind of... begin doing literary adaptations and maybe getting back a little bit into the more prestigious television space after a couple of years of blockbusters or pretty repeatable, you know, sitcoms and melodramas and stuff like that. And that they might try to like make an effort to be more. It Speaker 1 (12:32) feels like they were trying to do Heartland sort of stuff. Yeah, I think so. They're like, we want back in the Emmys race. And I think they know Speaker 2 (12:39) when they look at the numbers that something like Untamed with Eric Bana just does blockbuster numbers for them. Or something like Virgin River was on for five or six years or whatever it was. They know what people are watching. But I think after this Emmys, after we'll see what happens at the Oscars, it's been a minute. since they've polished any trophies. I mean, I know Matthew Rhys won for a show we're about to talk about. But Speaker 1 (13:05) I wonder if the Apple success is part of that in terms of Apple getting... forever hilarious that Apple got the best picture Oscar before Netflix, when Netflix threw so much money at the wall for years to try to make that happen. Yes. And then, yeah, and then this recent Apple success. And I think as these streamers and these networks continue to try to find their identity, so interesting to watch Amazon's identity, Prime Video's identity coalesce around this sort of YA romance thing that they're doing. The Apple. identity emerge as original wildly original sci-fi horror programming and also dad shows like Speaker 2 (13:43) sensitive dramedies yeah like 30 minute star-driven dramedies kind of yeah and Speaker 1 (13:48) then for netflix which has never had an identity netflix has always proposed where everything yeah Speaker 2 (13:53) you Speaker 1 (13:53) know um i think it's interesting for them to try to put their stamp on one thing or another yeah Speaker 2 (13:58) well the one big award if i'm correct i believe i believe i'm correct that netflix pulled from the broadcast Emmys last week. Last week? And it was Matthew Rhys' trophy for best actor in a limited series, anthology, or made-for-TV movie. And then today, mere days after the Emmys, after we all said, what a historic victory for an amazing guy. Wow. Speaker 1 (14:24) Nobody deserves it more. Three Emmys at the Rhys household. It was Speaker 2 (14:28) announced that The Beast in Me, which was conceived... This is from The Hollywood Reporter. The Beast in Me, which was conceived, executed, and won Emmys as a limited series. Now, though, Netflix has ordered a second season of the show with Claire Danes set to reprise her role and showrunner Howard Gordon returning. Let me just say this. I'm wearing an A's hat, but I'm going to let the Philadelphian out. Boo! Speaker 1 (14:53) This is Speaker 2 (14:54) bullshit. This is bullshit. This is horrible. Speaker 1 (14:57) Yes. Not the first time someone has done this, right? Big Little Lies did this for sure. I feel like maybe a couple other limited series have done this. But, you know, with love and respect to Matthew Rhys, who we adore, give that Emmy back. Also gives his wife a chance to catch up, which she deserves that chance. But I mean, like, I can't, I can believe they did this, but it is, it's, it's flagrant. After, Speaker 2 (15:22) FX. Now, Shogun, I believe they announced before the Emmys and during the nomination, like, what are you running for? I believe FX was like, Shogun is going to be a returning series. I'm trying to remember who another, I believe HBO did that as well for White Lotus. No, it would be an anthology series, so it would be fine. Somebody else did this. Speaker 1 (15:44) Big Little Lies, I think. Big Speaker 2 (15:45) Little Lies. Announced that like, hey, please don't consider us limited anymore. Speaker 1 (15:49) Oh, no, no. I think Big Little Lies won in limited and then, I'm sorry, did this and then announced season two. Speaker 2 (15:54) So I think this is horse shit. Yeah. I also. They knew. Speaker 1 (16:01) As somebody who's been watching Speaker 2 (16:02) Claire Danes for nigh on 35 years or whatever, whenever my so-called life came out. Speaker 1 (16:09) It is 35 years. Speaker 2 (16:10) I would not say that. Aggie from Beast and Me is my preferred character for her to do a continuing role in. This Speaker 1 (16:19) is just simply not a story that we need more of at all. And I'm not even sure it was a story that we needed as many episodes that we got in the first place. So Speaker 2 (16:26) I'm curious to see whether or not they changed the tone of the show. If Howard Gordon, and Howard Gordon's made a lot of really great television shows, but he