Don't Leave Your Financial Future To Chance

The Ramsey Show

The Ramsey Show addresses two callers facing significant financial challenges: Josh, a former auto repair business owner with $100K in debt

Key takeaways

• Financial setbacks like business failure are common but not permanent; recovery is possible with discipline and emotional clarity.
• Prioritize paying off the largest debts first by tackling tax liabilities and vendor balances strategically using settlement offers.

Main topics

• Debt management strategies
• Rebuilding after business failure

Notable quotes

"You've got a bit of a math problem, but it's not overwhelming. But it's also believing that Josh is a good guy. Josh can win."

Conclusion

The episode emphasizes that financial recovery is achievable through disciplined

Transcript preview

Speaker 1 (0:04) Brought to you by the EveryDollar app. Start budgeting for free today. Speaker 1 (0:18) Normal is broke and common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey Network and the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio, this is The Ramsey Show. George Camel, Ramsey personality, number one best-selling author and co-host of Smart Money Happy Hour, is my co-host today. The phone number here is 888-825-5225. The call is free, and some say the advice is worth exactly what you pay for it. Josh is in Virginia Beach. Hey, Josh, what's up? Speaker 1 (0:49) Better than I deserve. How can we help? Speaker 8 (0:55) What's going Speaker 3 (0:59) on? What happened? Speaker 8 (1:12) A whole nine yards there. And even though I'm making good money, I still got six bucks in my bank account by the time I pay the bills. Speaker 3 (1:21) How much debt do you have? Speaker 8 (1:24) About $100,000. Combined with my old business, around $100,000. Speaker 3 (1:28) Okay. And how much do you make now? Speaker 8 (1:30) I'm making right at $85,000 a year at the new job I started. I was making about $80,000. Speaker 1 (1:37) Good for you. Josh, how long ago did you close your business? Speaker 8 (1:42) Literally, actually my last day in my shop was the first of the year. Speaker 8 (1:48) And I've been about eight months now. Speaker 1 (1:51) What kind of business was it? Speaker 8 (1:52) It was auto repair. How Speaker 1 (1:54) long did you have it? Speaker 8 (1:55) Fifteen years. Speaker 1 (1:56) Wow. That's kind of heartbreaking, isn't it? Speaker 8 (2:00) It is. Speaker 1 (2:00) Yeah. Speaker 8 (2:01) But there were a lot of bad decisions, and choices there kind of led me into a financial pit. So how much of the $100K Speaker 1 (2:10) is business debt, and what kind of debt is it? Speaker 8 (2:14) I got the taxes, and they hit me with a bunch of penalties and everything. So I got probably about $70,000 in the taxes with penalties. And then just the vendors and everything, probably about another $15,000, $18,000. Speaker 1 (2:28) Okay. That's $85,000, and then the other $15,000 is what? Speaker 8 (2:32) Yeah. Well, actually, then I got my vehicle payment, which is, or my vehicle is $22,000. I still owe on it. Mm Speaker 1 (2:41) -hmm. Speaker 8 (2:44) Credit cards, I'm right about $3,000 in credit card debt. Speaker 1 (2:47) Yeah. What's the vehicle? Speaker 8 (2:49) It's a Jeep. Okay. Wrangler. What's Speaker 1 (2:52) it worth? Speaker 8 (2:54) Probably $17,000. Speaker 1 (2:56) You're single? Speaker 8 (2:56) Yeah. Speaker 1 (2:58) Okay. All right. Speaker 1 (3:03) I've been through closing a business and the heartbreak of that and the gut punch that that was to my confidence. And so sometimes in these situations, it's more about confidence and believing that it is an actual math problem. You've got a bit of a math problem, but it's not overwhelming. But it's also believing that Josh is a good guy. Josh can win. Josh knows how to do big things again. And Josh does. He ran a dadgum thing for 15 years. Okay? You just made a few mistakes and got tripped up. And so now we've got to work our way out of those things. But if you're single and making 85, we can address these things and push your way through it. So if I'm you, how old are you? Speaker 8 (3:48) I'm 42. Speaker 1 (3:49) Okay. So if I'm you, I don't have anybody to tell what to do except the guy in my mirror. And so I'm going to set up camp in the cheapest possible safe and clean one-bedroom apartment, and then I'm going to start working all the time, spending nothing, and cleaning up this debt as aggressively as I can. You could think about selling the Jeep. But, meh, maybe not. It's not that big a deal. It's not your biggest problem. Your biggest problem by far is taxes. Are you paying anything on those right now? Speaker 8 (4:23) Not yet. I mean, I've just been paying all the other debts and everything. I've been trying to pay all the personal debts. Yeah, Speaker 1 (4:30) and the vendors that were your friends. Speaker 8 (4:32) Right. And that's where my whole paycheck now is going from. other than my G payment, which it got behind and I had double the payments up on it. Yeah, you need to get it caught Speaker 1 (4:45) up. But what happened was, is you were in a tailspin and you were dizzy and the chaos came in. And so you were doing a bad job, a disorganized job because of the failure and the loss of confidence, failure on the business. And that's normal. And I don't blame you for that, but I just want to give you permission to be where you are. And now let's fight our way out of it. So here's what I want you to do. I want you to... Get above this problem and get away from all the emotion and just look at the facts. The facts are we got $85,000 coming in. These $15,000 worth of vendors will work with you. They'll probably settle for pennies on the dollar. If you'll go to RamseySolutions.com and click on Tax Professional on the ELP side, they'll help you set up a payment plan on the tax and keep them from coming down on your head randomly because they will randomly come in and screw up your life. Get the credit card paid off and get the Jeep paid off, the vendors paid off, and then work on the taxes. And so, you know, work these off smallest to largest. The good news is you have a very, very marketable skill for a side hustle called fixing cars. Speaker 1 (5:55) Did you come out of this with a tool set? Speaker 8 (5:58) Yes. Speaker 1 (5:59) Okay. Speaker 8 (5:59) Yeah, I mean, and that was another issue I'm at right now is I'm renting a one-bedroom apartment. Speaker 1 (6:06) Good. Speaker 8 (6:07) Utility and everything is $800 a month, which is dirt cheap. Great. That's good. Excellent. But if I could find something that I had a little bit of space to work, I could do side work and make money on. Speaker 1 (6:20) Yep. Speaker 8 (6:21) But that's also a gamble. Speaker 1 (6:23) Well, I mean, here's Speaker 8 (6:24) the Speaker 1 (6:24) thing. I want you to go get some side work. And there are guys that roll up in the parking lot here at Ramsey and work on people's cars in the parking lot while they're at work. Mobile repair. Speaker 1 (6:36) And they don't need a space because there's a brake job going on out in the parking lot right now probably. It's half the time I'm out there. Speaker 3 (6:45) That Speaker 1 (6:45) business Speaker 3 (6:45) is blowing up because you can start it with nothing. Speaker 1 (6:47) Yeah, and all you need is your tool set, and you can do the basic stuff, some maintenance stuff. Obviously, you can't pull an engine in the parking lot of their office, but you can do some of the other stuff and make some really good side money while you're doing this. And then, George, I think we need to put him on every dollar budget. and take the 85 plus any side hustle money we can scrape together and then start working a debt snowball. Speaker 3 (7:09) Yeah, I mean, if you're saying your rent is pretty cheap, your expenses are pretty cheap, sounds like most of his income is going out to those debt payments. But Speaker 1 (7:16) if Speaker 3 (7:17) we can throw a couple grand at that debt a month, we can clean this up in a couple years. Speaker 1 (7:21) And I want you to call those vendors. I know they're the ones that are tugging at your heart the most. But if you owe a guy $5,000 and he hasn't been paid in nine months, just say, hey, man, I'm over here. I'm living in one bedroom. I'm broke. what will you take to settle this debt? I want to stand up and pay you, and what would you take to settle it? You owe him $5,000. He'll probably say, hey, send me a couple grand. We'll call it a day. Get that in writing so it doesn't come back to haunt you, and then send him a couple grand. They'll settle with you, though. Vendors will. But the thing is, when you're a small business guy like that, most of those vendors are your friends. And so you don't want to pee on your friends, right? But in this situation, I'm going to ask for some mercy, you know, like when you're a kid. Uncle. Right? You got me down, uncle. Right? And they'll be shocked to hear from you. Well, they'll be pleased that after nine months that they got anything. Exactly. They thought you were gone. And that's the thing. So they'll settle with you. This is not like some stupid credit card company with some collector in a cubicle 500 miles away who can't keep a real job and is calling you 42 times. That's not who we're dealing with. We're dealing with a guy you know down the street. Speaker 3 (9:01) Hey, George Camel here. A few years ago, someone stole my identity. And let me tell you, that is not a quick fix. It takes hours on the phone, piles of paperwork, and a whole lot of stress trying to untangle the mess. And even after that, there's this nagging paranoia because your information is already out there. And the truth is, you can do all the right things and still become a victim. That's how common identity theft is. And that's why I'm glad I had Zander's Identity Theft Protection. When my identity was stolen, their team stepped in right away. They were monitoring my information and caught the issue, and their U.S.-based recovery specialists helped handle the calls, the paperwork, the cleanup, so I didn't have to do it all on my own. Zander also includes up to $2 million in stolen funds and expense reimbursement, and with the family plan, your kids are covered for free. You work too hard to let identity theft steal your time, your money, and your peace of mind. So go to Zander.com to enroll today or call 800-356-4282. Speaker 1 (10:08) Ramsey's taking over an entire cruise ship. 2,500 Ramsey people who beat debt, change their family trees, they're on Baby Step 4 and beyond, and they're celebrating with the ultimate debt-free vacation. If you're on the cruise or you get on the cruise before we sell it out, here's what's going to be waiting for you. Seven days with me and all the Ramsey personalities in the Western Caribbean, new wealth-building teachings, the world's largest debt-free scream, live episodes from your favorite Ramsey shows, and a whole lot more. If you're a baby step four or up, click the link in the show notes and go to RamseySolutions.com slash events and book your cabin right now. George, I just heard my friend, and I just really love this woman, is going to be one of our musical guests, the one and only Natalie Grant. And, man, she is a wonderful human being but also has a world-class voice. And just so I'm really excited to have her with us on here. And we had Stephen Curtis Chapman with us last year. So, I mean, we got the lineup of lineups. You got all the entertainment you could ask for. Yeah. Oh, it's going to be something. You're going to be. entertained out. If you're bored, it's your fault. Exactly. So again, go to ramseysolutions.com slash events, or you can click the link in the show notes and get registered for this cruise. It's next March, and it is not quite sold out. You can still get some of the cabins, and there's some specials running literally today. So check it out. Julie's in Houston, Texas. Hi, Julie. How are you? Hey, Speaker 7 (11:40) doing well. Thanks for taking my call. Speaker 1 (11:42) Sure. What's up? Speaker 7 (11:45) So I initially attempted to enter into an agreement with my father to purchase a house that he had inherited from my great aunt. And I sort of had to compromise on the purchase price by giving him an upfront $5,000 to remove the lien that was on the house. That lien was a Medicaid lien. He could not sell the house unless that lien was removed. And so I did that with the understanding that we were good with the agreement and the purchase going forward. But he ended up using that money to remove the lien and then decided that he's going to sell the house for more money than our agreement because that's what's best for him. You know, I told him that I expected to be paid back if that was his decision. But I feel like this is just another way that he has sort of been dishonest and hurtful, I think, financially in our relationship. And it makes it complicated that he's also my dad. And I know that I'm called to honor this relationship. But I do feel like there is some financial... issues between us that I'm having a difficult time navigating and just would like some advice on how to go forward. All Speaker 1 (13:18) right. So you said another. So this is not the first time he's done something underhanded or dishonest to you. I Speaker 4 (13:28) feel like this is the worst where. No, it's not the first time. It's a pattern. Speaker 1 (13:33) And you know that this guy is a crocodile. Speaker 7 (13:36) The pattern is we're very generous with him, and he loves our generosity. You know, we've purchased transmissions that have happened. No, Speaker 1 (13:47) that is not true. You're putting sugar on top of a bird. He's Speaker 7 (13:52) a crocodile. He Speaker 1 (13:53) loves that he can take advantage of you. You have felt taken advantage of as a pattern, and yet you gave him $5,000, which you should not have done. Because, by the way, you can have a lien removed from the house at the closing. Speaker 1 (14:09) You don't have to do it before the closing. So you could have given the title company the purchase price, and they could have removed the lien, and then given him the net proceeds, which is the way a normal human does a transaction if you're not a crocodile. Okay? All right. So here's the thing. You've got to separate your—you do not honor—when the Bible says to honor your parents, it does not say to honor your parents' misbehavior. It's honoring the office of father, the office of mother. And that's like, for instance, I agreed with almost nothing that Joe Biden did or said when he was the president of the United States. Some of you loved him. I didn't. Okay? But the Bible calls for me to honor those that are in power and pray for them. So I'm going to honor the presidency, but not the things that Joe did as president. So I can honor my father, but I don't have to honor his cocaine use. Speaker 1 (15:12) I'm not saying my father does cocaine. That's not what I'm saying. But the point being, okay, that your dad, you can honor the position of father and say, I honor you as my dad, but I cannot do financial transactions with you anymore because I can't trust you. That's not dishonoring. It's just observation. Speaker 7 (15:34) I think I know how this is going to turn out. I do, too. He's going to be pissed next time he Speaker 1 (15:40) can't take money from you. Speaker 7 (15:43) Well, I think he's going to sell this house and he's going to feel real rich for three years. And he's basically selling the inheritance that could have gone, you know, to my grandkids that I was even willing to purchase and take on, you know, that responsibility to give something, you know, to make a generational role. Speaker 1 (16:03) I'm sorry, but there was no generational role for the crocodile. That was an illusion. Speaker 7 (16:10) You need to let Speaker 1 (16:11) that go. That's gone. He owns the house, and he decided not to sell it to you. But once he sells Speaker 7 (16:19) and he's out of money, I know he's going to depend on me. No, he's not. No, he's not, because I'm not going to give him Speaker 1 (16:24) any more money. You can't depend on me if I say no. Speaker 3 (16:29) When he steps out that door, there's going to be no doormat named Julie waiting to fund his misbehavior again. So you get to set the boundary. There's no depending on you anymore. You're not going to enable him. I'm not required to Speaker 7 (16:40) care for him and his old age. No, absolutely not. Speaker 3 (16:43) He's a grown adult. Speaker 7 (16:44) He has nothing. He has no 401k. That's Speaker 3 (16:46) his Speaker 7 (16:46) problem. He has no savings. That's his problem. Here's Speaker 3 (16:49) the hard part, Julie. Nothing you could do could change that. Because you just showed him. If you give him $10,000, it's gone. It doesn't matter. Speaker 1 (16:59) It's an endless pit. You do not owe him. You're a classic enabler. Okay? I mean, you're just handing out money thinking it's going to make everything okay. It never makes everything okay. It just makes it more of what it already is. You're not helping him when you participate in his crocodile tears. Speaker 1 (17:21) You're harming him. And so you just stand back and go, you know, I love you. You got issues. And I hope it all works out for you. And, you know, if you're out of food and you're hungry, I'll buy you a Kroger card, which does not allow alcohol or cigarettes on it. So it only allows food. So there you go. What's he going to do with the proceeds from the house? He's going to take them and use them and blow them. That's what he's done his whole life. Speaker 4 (17:48) He's going to pay off his Speaker 7 (17:50) debt. He's going to pay off his debt, and then it's going to be gone. And my thought was, well, if he ever needed anything, at least we'd have an asset where we could pull out an equity line of credit or something. You know, if there was ever an emergency, we would have a source of wealth to help him. And instead of trying to reason through Speaker 1 (18:07) that with him. Speaker 7 (18:07) He's not the problem. Speaker 1 (18:08) He's not the problem. You are. Because I can't get you in this conversation to recognize that crocodiles do one thing, and that's bite. And every time I talk about it, don't feed the crocodile. All you do is figure out a way to get the food out. Speaker 7 (18:22) Well, I don't know how to navigate family holidays. Like, how do you even have relationships? I Speaker 1 (18:27) don't Speaker 7 (18:27) give you Speaker 1 (18:27) money. If you would like to come over and eat, that's fine. But I don't give you money. If the only way you want to come to Christmas is for me to give you $5,000, I guess we're not going to see you at Christmas. And if he chooses not to come, Speaker 3 (18:42) that's on him. Speaker 3 (18:44) I think you're trying to save this relationship that is broken. Speaker 1 (18:48) With money. You're trying to grow this guy's character. I Speaker 4 (18:51) recognize. Speaker 1 (18:52) Julie, I can't help you. This is the 14th time you've argued with me and you called and asked us what to do. What you have is a boundary problem. You are a classic enabler. Go see a therapist. Somebody needs to walk you through how to say no. You've gotten this so tangled up that somehow it's all going to be okay someday. It's not going to be okay. The guy's a freaking crook. I'm sorry he's your father, but he's a crook. He's a bad dude. Don't participate with him in his delusional crap. You're not helping him. You're not helping your family. You're not helping you. Get some help, girl. Speaker 1 (20:00) Date nights are supposed to be fun, but between what theater tickets cost now and what Hollywood keeps putting on screens, that's not always the case. Angel can help with that. They make movies and shows your family can feel good about, and right now they have a deal worth knowing about. Become a premium member of the Angel Guild today, and you'll get access to Angel's entire family-friendly streaming library, free tickets to every future Angel theatrical release, and two free tickets to their new film, The Brink of War. It's about the 1986 summit in Iceland where President Reagan and Soviet leader Gorbachev faced off. It's a great movie, worth seeing on the big screen. And the best part is, when you use... promo code DATENIGHT, you get four months free on an annual membership. That's a great deal and will mean some great date nights. Go to angel.com slash Ramsey, become a premium member of the Angel Guild, and use code DATENIGHT. That's angel.com slash Ramsey, or click the link in the description. Limited time offer. Visit angel.com slash Ramsey for details. Speaker 1 (21:28) Stephanie is in Sacramento. Hi, Stephanie. How are you? Speaker 7 (21:31) I'm good. How are you? Speaker 1 (21:33) Better than I deserve. What's up? Speaker 7 (21:34) Good. Well, I'm kind of in a dilemma. I'm currently on baby step five, and I finally actually reached that 15 % for my retirement. Good. But I'm going to be needing a new car in the next year or two. So I'm just wondering if you recommend backing off of investing. to be able to save more in anticipation of a new car, or how should I navigate that? Speaker 1 (22:02) Typically in a budget, if you're only putting 15 % away and you have your emergency fund and you have zero other debt, you should have some margin to save for a car. Speaker 7 (22:11) Yeah, I do. I have about $13,000 saved up right now. Okay, and what's Speaker 1 (22:16) the Speaker 7 (22:16) car Speaker 1 (22:16) you're driving worth? Speaker 7 (22:19) It's probably worth about $15,000, but it has 150,000 miles on it. Speaker 1 (22:25) So if you bought a car today, you could buy almost a $30,000 car. Speaker 7 (22:29) Right, yeah. What's Speaker 1 (22:30) wrong with that? Speaker 7 (22:31) Well, I worry because the last two cars I've had have essentially blown up, and I've been like fourth to go into debt to be able to get a new vehicle. So it just kind of worries me a little bit. You're worried that a $30 Speaker 1 (22:44) ,000 car is going to blow up. Speaker 7 (22:47) Well, no, not a $30,000 car. That's what we're talking Speaker 1 (22:51) about, aren't we? Speaker 4 (22:53) I guess so, yeah. Speaker 3 (22:55) Okay. I think you have the trauma from the past vehicle stuck in your head and a $30,000 car that you do a pre-purchase inspection on and you buy a quality make model year. Yeah. It's going to be just fine. So how much are you looking to spend? Speaker 7 (23:08) Well, I mean, the new and used ones I'm looking at with like similar to my current vehicle are about that 40,000 range. So that's what my goal is. I'm trying to get to 40 and I'm just holding my breath. What Speaker 1 (23:20) is your vehicle? Speaker 7 (23:22) It's a 2019 Jeep Grand Cherokee. Speaker 1 (23:26) Okay. And what are you wanting? A brand new Jeep, almost brand new Jeep. You want Speaker 3 (23:30) another Jeep? Speaker 7 (23:31) Probably, yeah. What were the ones that blew up on you? Should I give that information over the radio? Sure. Speaker 1 (23:39) Inquiring minds want to know. Did they blow up or not? If they blew up, it's okay to say it. Speaker 7 (23:43) I mean, my previous one before this was a different type of Jeep, and then before that was, oh, I can't even remember, but it was like a small little get Speaker 1 (23:52) -around car. Speaker 7 (23:52) Are you single? I am. I'm a single mom. What is your Speaker 1 (23:56) household income? Speaker 7 (23:57) I make about $6,000 a month. Speaker 1 (24:00) Okay. How long have you been listening to us? Speaker 7 (24:05) I, well, I actually, when I finished my school, I kind of did a deep dive to be able to pay off my student loans and debt by using your method. Speaker 1 (24:14) Okay, so what do we say about cars, the maximum car you ought to purchase? Do you remember? Speaker 7 (24:18) Yeah, I think is it like, I can't remember the ratio, but it's like a percentage of your annual income. Right. Which Speaker 1 (24:28) would not be 40. Speaker 7 (24:30) Yeah. Speaker 1 (24:31) It's too much. Speaker 7 (24:33) Okay. Speaker 1 (24:34) I wouldn't spend that much on a car in your situation. So I'd go get a 30. And so two things I want you to come away with, and George said it and I don't want you to miss it. Get a pre-purchase inspection. If you've got a Christian Brothers Automotive in your area, go by and see them. They do a great job. If not, find a reputable, independent car mechanic and ask them what they'll do, what they'll charge you for a pre-purchase inspection. It might be $100. Take it by there. The second thing I'm going to tell you is to read about the particular type of car that you're thinking of purchasing and what the reliability factor is. Because there's all kinds of gossip out there on cars. And it may or may not be accurate, but at least you want to read about it and try to figure it out. Speaker 3 (25:19) You might learn that specific gear, make a model. You could also Speaker 1 (25:21) ask that guy, that mechanic, you know, does this car have a good reputation? Okay. I'll give you an example. The car you're talking about does not have a good repair reputation. Speaker 1 (25:35) It's not got a good repair reputation. So you may want to look elsewhere. But you can look around, make sure. They may have fixed them. They may be better in recent years. But five years ago, I would have told you just don't buy that based on just what I've heard. Okay. The one you're driving. Okay. And the last Speaker 3 (25:51) one you had blew up. So maybe it's time to switch. We switch makes and models from trying something else. Just Speaker 1 (25:57) check it out. That's the point. You don't do it based on a couple of guys on a podcast. But I want you to check it out. I want you to read. If you can get a hold of something like Consumer Reports or anything on Kelly Blue Book is fine. Edmunds. Edmunds Car Guide's got really good articles on repair things and things that are going on. There was a few years ago. Oh, gosh, it's a long time ago now. It's decades ago. But I remember Cadillac came out with a front-wheel drive, and they put an aluminum block engine in the thing, and they were. You couldn't find any of them with an engine in them. They'd all blown. It was a piece of crap. And so anybody looked at that Cadillac, looked at a Cross-Eye that knew anything about cars and said, don't buy that car. That's 20-year-old information, okay? It's not current information, or older even, probably 30. But anyway, point being, you can find out from a mechanic, from people that know cars, that that model has issues, that type of car has issues. Don't go that way. And you can just research that and figure it out. And so I want you to do that, and then I want you to have the car checked out. And I think $30,000 is plenty to spend, so you've almost got enough now. But please do not walk into the Jeep dealership, Speaker 3 (27:05) because they're going to steer you to the new cars and say, we can get your payment down, whatever you want it to be. No payments. You've got to go to an independent dealer's where you're probably going to find the best price. Pay in cash. No payments. Speaker 1 (27:14) No payments. And Speaker 3 (27:15) if you're not a millionaire, always buy used. Speaker 1 (27:17) Yeah. No payments. No car payments. Did you hear me? No car payments, people. Car payments are the siren song of the middle class. If you want to be middle class or below the rest of your life, keep a stinking car payment. Well, I was forced to buy a car. Well, I had to buy a car. That car's not safe. It needs an airbag. And you're talking to a guy who, when I was growing up, the only airbag in the passenger seat was your mother-in-law. Oh, sick burn. There was no airbags. So come on, guys. We lived through all of that. So you can get a car that's safe and reliable that you pay cash for and no car payments. It's the largest thing that people buy that go down in value, and they all go down in value like a rock. That's where Chevy got that. All right, open phones at 888-825-5225. Steve is in Idaho. Hi, Steve. What's up? Hey, how are Speaker 2 (28:17) you doing, Dave? Speaker 1 (28:18) Better than I deserve. How can we help? Speaker 2 (28:20) So I have a house that I'm in the market to sell. I'm up here in Bonner's Ferry for about $500, $550. And we want to move down to Coeur d'Alene, which is about an hour and a half south of here. And I have a daughter and granddaughter that live down there. So we thought we'd be closer with the granddaughter and help out. She's a single mom, help out with stuff. And we would... You know, we put up a sale. We just go down and buy something down there. But lately I've been thinking maybe I should just rent rather than buy. Speaker 1 (28:57) How old are you? Speaker 2 (28:58) What do you think of that? I am 68. Speaker 1 (29:00) Okay. Are you in good health? Speaker 2 (29:03) Oh, yeah, pretty good. Speaker 1 (29:05) Okay. So you probably make it to 88 or 90-something. Yeah. On average. My Speaker 2 (29:11) dad made it to 98. Okay. Speaker 1 (29:12) Well, somewhere in the 90s then. All right. So we've got 20, 25 years. So the house that you're in is 550. Yeah. How long you had it? 10 years. Okay. What'd you buy it for? Speaker 2 (29:26) Two... So Speaker 1 (29:28) it doubled in 10 years. Speaker 2 (29:29) 230. Speaker 1 (29:30) And guess what? 10 years before that, it was 100. Speaker 1 (29:34) Yeah, probably. Yeah. So you just lost $400,000 in this conversation while you were a renter. Well, Speaker 2 (29:42) maybe, but... No, not maybe. I mean from Speaker 1 (29:44) 68 to 98. Okay. Speaker 2 (29:47) That's 30 freaking years. You lost Speaker 1 (29:49) $400,000 or $500,000 if you don't go buy a house. Speaker 2 (29:53) I don't have to mow the lawn. I don't have to pay property taxes. You've got to mow the lawn. Speaker 1 (29:57) Right Speaker 3 (29:57) now. You're paying property Speaker 1 (29:58) taxes as Speaker 2 (29:59) a Speaker 1 (29:59) renter. Well, for $400,000 or $500,000, you can pay somebody to mow the lawn. Speaker 2 (30:06) Yeah, I could do that. So you don't think that's a good idea? Speaker 1 (30:10) I'm positive it's not a good idea. What would a house over there cost? Speaker 2 (30:16) I could buy, this house is about 3,400 square feet. So you downsize and Speaker 1 (30:23) pay cash? Yeah. If you pay cash for a house and you own it, your costs don't go up except the insurance and the taxes. If you're a renter, 100 % of the rent goes up. Can you imagine how much your rent will go up in 25 years? You want to screw up your retirement budget? You want to mess up that golden rocking chair on the front porch? Yeah, be a renter. That'll screw it up. Don't do that, man. Speaker 6 (31:16) Hey, this is Dr. John Deloney. I take my sleep seriously because better sleep means better health. And if you've been losing sleep or waking up sore because you've got some old, thin, gross mattress that wasn't designed with you in mind, it's time to make a change. I love... Helix mattresses. They make mattresses for real individual people. Whether you're a side sleeper, a back sleeper, whether you sleep hot, or if you and your partner have completely different sleep styles, Helix has a mattress designed just for you. 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