Change Your Habits, Change Your Life

The Ramsey Show

In this episode of The Ramsey Show, George Kamel and Dr. John Deloney provide intense financial and relational guidance to callers facing va

Key takeaways

• Caller Sarah is struggling with $95,000 in debt despite a six-figure salary; hosts recommend using the EveryDollar app and attacking the smallest debts first.
• For Alyssa, recovering from domestic violence, Dr. John Deloney emphasizes that financial transparency and boundaries are essential components of physical safety.
• A family with six children must prioritize an upcoming $40,000 medical expense over college funding to avoid taking on student loans.
• Jake's strategy to sell his car to pay off debt is discouraged; instead, hosts suggest leveraging seasonal wedding income to snowball existing debts.
• Ryan's extensive vehicle collection creates significant financial drag that could be resolved by selling specific assets like his Mustang to clear truck debt.

Main topics

• Debt Snowball Method
• Financial Safety in Relationships
• College Savings Strategies

Notable quotes

Normal is broke and common sense is weird.

Conclusion

The episode serves as a call to action for individuals to embrace radi

Transcript preview

Speaker 6 (0:04) Brought to you by the EveryDollar app. Start budgeting for free today. Speaker 8 (0:14) Normal is broke and common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey Network in the Fairwinds Credit Union studio, this is The Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by Dr. John Deloney, taking your calls in the next couple of hours at 888-825-5225. Sarah joins us in Cleveland to kick it off. What's going on, Sarah? Speaker 5 (0:38) Hi, I was calling. I just have a ton of debt. And I honestly, I've made the payments and everything for the last year and a half. But it's gotten to the point now where all my interest rates went up to where my payments have doubled. And I'm basically I've made all my payments every month, except for after I make all my payments, I tend to live off of my credit cards because I don't have any cash left. on everything and I just I don't know how to get out from under my credit cards I this is the first time I missed three credit card payments this month that um I didn't get paid and I just I don't know how to get out from underneath them why Speaker 4 (1:20) didn't you get paid Speaker 5 (1:22) No, I got paid. They didn't get paid. Speaker 4 (1:25) Oh, they didn't get paid. Okay. Speaker 5 (1:26) Yeah, like this is the first time that three of my credit cards didn't get payments. Speaker 2 (1:32) Gotcha. Are you talking about minimum payments? Speaker 5 (1:34) Yeah, it's just the minimum payments. Speaker 2 (1:36) Okay. Well, let me tell you, if you just make minimum payments, the debt will swallow you whole. that APR of 29 % Speaker 8 (1:44) while you're making a payment of 50 to 100 bucks a month is not going to touch the balance. So what you need to do is just lay them all out and attack the smallest one and just make the minimums on the rest. Now, it sounds like you're trying to do that, but you're also still using the cards. And that's part of the problem. Speaker 5 (2:02) Well, one of my credit cards, the payment is $679 a month. Speaker 8 (2:06) Goodness. How much credit card debt is this altogether? Speaker 5 (2:09) All together credit card. That one there is just, that one there I owe $21,000 on $157. What's the total, total, total? Speaker 2 (2:17) Give me everything in one bucket. How much is it? Speaker 5 (2:21) $21,800, $12,000, $6,000, $17,000, $1,800. Those are all my credit cards. Speaker 2 (2:29) Do you have other debt? Speaker 5 (2:31) I do. I have like, I had to get siding on my house. I owe $14,000 for that. And I have a personal loan that was $7,300. I have a mortgage and a car payment. Speaker 4 (2:42) Wow. Are you single? Speaker 5 (2:44) Yeah, I am. Speaker 4 (2:46) Okay. How much do you make annually? Speaker 5 (2:50) About $103,000. Okay. Speaker 2 (2:54) Wow. Well, you're calling us because you're at the end of the rope here. You're going, I can't, I'm starting to miss payments. You weren't making progress before. You were just barely staying afloat, it sounds like. Speaker 5 (3:04) Yes. Speaker 2 (3:05) All Speaker 4 (3:05) right, Sarah, I want to tell you this, okay? Number one, I'm glad you called. And number two, this is really scary, and we're going to give you a plan that will work 100 % of the time if you'll just work it, okay? But you have to decide, I'm done with this way of doing life. Speaker 5 (3:24) Oh, I am done. I want to just, because I make fantastic money, and if I didn't have all this debt, I wouldn't need it. Speaker 4 (3:33) There you go, sister. I make fantastic money. That's Speaker 5 (3:35) it. Speaker 4 (3:35) You already are future casting what your life would not only look like, but would feel like, how much peace you would have, how much laughter you would have, like just how well you'd be able to sleep if you didn't have this, because you're working your butt off all week, all month, all year, and then you find yourself getting further and further behind. But it can't be, and again, this is 30 plus years of doing this. It can't be, with the hole you've dug, you have a big shovel, which is great, but you can't partly get out. You have to decide I'm all in or we'll love you and we'll just say best of luck to you and we'll still be friends and all that. But you have to make the choice and I'm calling you out. Make the choice today. I'm going to be done with doing life this way, and that means I'm going to have to be radical, and my friends are going to think I'm weird, and I'm going to do something completely different so that I can make this great six-figure salary doing what I'm good at and what I love, and I want to start loving the life that I have all around that job, right? Speaker 5 (4:31) Yes. Speaker 2 (4:32) All right, game on. I'm glad you're here. Thanks. What's left on the car loan? Speaker 5 (4:38) The car loan, I owe $14,238. Speaker 2 (4:42) Okay. So based on my napkin math here from everything you threw at us, you're in about $95,000 in debt. Does that sound about right outside of a mortgage? Speaker 5 (4:53) Approximately, yeah. Maybe a little less, but yes. Speaker 2 (4:55) Have you pulled your credit report to get a real picture of what's going on? Speaker 5 (5:00) The last time I looked at it, it was like 685 was my credit score. Not Speaker 2 (5:04) your Speaker 5 (5:04) credit score, Speaker 2 (5:05) your credit report. That's going to show you all the accounts, all the balances. Speaker 5 (5:10) One of my credit cards gives that to me free, so it has it all on there. What a gift. Speaker 2 (5:15) That's nice of them. There's a Speaker 4 (5:17) perk we don't talk about enough. That's like giving you an ice pack after we punch you and punch you and punch you. It's like, here, we give away free ice. Like, thanks, man. Speaker 5 (5:24) Yes. Speaker 2 (5:25) Okay, so what are you doing for work? Speaker 5 (5:29) I am a nurse. I work three days a week, and then I just picked up a second job, and I've been trying to pick up extra at my job. Speaker 2 (5:36) Good. What's the second job? Speaker 5 (5:39) The second job, I'm working in a doctor's office just one day a week. Speaker 2 (5:42) What's that pay you? Speaker 5 (5:44) The doctor's office pays me $25 an hour. Speaker 2 (5:47) Okay. And you can ramp that up if you needed to. I'm trying to figure out which levers we can pull here for the income side. Speaker 5 (5:55) Well, I could pick up extra more at my other job because I make more money there. I make $55.60 an hour. Yeah. Speaker 2 (6:01) The more you can do at your full-time job, it's going to be even better. You said $103 is your gross income? Speaker 5 (6:08) Approximately. Yeah, I think it was $103 in some hundreds last year. Speaker 2 (6:12) Okay. Are you taking home about $6,000 a month? Speaker 5 (6:17) No, my bring home is almost $5,000 a month. I have insurance. It's like $300 a pay. And I did cut down my 401k because I did have it at 8%. I dropped that down to 3%. So that way I wouldn't still get the free money they offer because they match it. So I went from 8 % down to 3%. Hear me out. Are Speaker 2 (6:43) we concerned about free money right now when we're missing our credit card payments at 29 %? Speaker 5 (6:48) No, I guess we shouldn't be. Speaker 2 (6:50) What if we're doing something countercultural, like John said, and we took our match down to zero? Okay. Just for 18 to 24 months. That's it. And then, boom, you just freed up $3,000 a year right there. Speaker 8 (7:02) Okay. It may not feel like a lot, but what that does is two things. Number one, it frees up real money back in your paycheck, and it also gets you a little bit more angry at your debt. Because now it's not just stressing you out in the present. It's robbing you from your future. And now you have an onus to go even harder in the pain of this debt. And that plus a thousand other things is what it's going to take. It's not going to be one thing that's going to be the magic sauce here. It's going to be, I'm going to do a budget every day, look at my accounts every day, look at the balances every day, and look at that smallest one with a vengeance and attack it with all the margin I can muster up through extra work, cutting my expenses down to nothing. And you're single, so you can do this without affecting many people, right? Right. Good. So no one's going to be like, man, I wish you were home more. It's just you. So that's a blessing because right now you could work 60, 70 hours a week. Speaker 4 (7:52) What's your Speaker 2 (7:52) mortgage Speaker 4 (7:53) payment Speaker 2 (7:53) every month? $11.78. Oh, wonderful. Good, good. So the debt payments, have you added them up to see what it would take to just cover the minimum payments Speaker 8 (8:02) on all debts for a month? Speaker 5 (8:06) I think I did, but it's like... Speaker 2 (8:13) Is it $2,000? Speaker 5 (8:16) No, it's more than that. Okay. Speaker 8 (8:19) So here's your homework. I'm going to give you our EveryDollar premium budgeting app. And what you're going to do is list out the next upcoming paychecks. You're going to jot down all of your expenses, including the minimum payments on those debts. And then you're going to see how much margin there is. And if there's not a lot, that tells us we've got to cut some expenses. We've got to increase the income. That margin, that little green number at the top showing you there's $1,000 left over if you do it this way, that is your ticket to freedom. Meal prep, Speaker 4 (8:44) no more going out to lunch, no more going out to dinner. We're going to be all over this. getting this debt paid off. Speaker 3 (9:01) Hey guys, it's Rachel Cruz. When it comes to life insurance, most people fall into one of two camps. The ones who make a plan to protect their family and the ones who hope everything will just work out. But hope isn't a financial plan. When you get married or have kids, your money decisions aren't just about you anymore. Your income helps keep the lights on, pay the mortgage, and put food on the table. And if something happens to you, will your family have protection or uncertainty? Well, at Ramsey, we recommend term life insurance that 10 to 12 times your income with a 15 to 20 year term for the years that your kids are at home and your mortgage is still being paid off. That's why Winston and I have our term life coverage through Zander Insurance. They're an independent broker who works for you, shopping all the top companies to find the most competitive prices on coverage you need. Get instant quotes online in just minutes at Zander.com or call 800-356-8000. Speaker 3 (10:04) That's zander.com or 800-356-4282. Speaker 2 (10:23) Alyssa is in Oklahoma City up next. What's going on, Alyssa? How can we help today? Speaker 3 (10:28) Hi, yes. Thank you for having me. And, John, your work, book, and show just has impacted my life so much. I just want to say thank you for Speaker 4 (10:36) doing what you do. Thanks, Alyssa. I appreciate that. Speaker 3 (10:39) Yeah, so my husband and I have been married 12 years. The majority of those years we don't do finances together, which is not my choice. And up until the last year and a half, that we've been back together because we separated for six months due to DV. Things have gotten, like, much better except this area. There's been small changes, and I've had to set boundaries. We didn't file taxes together this year to, you know, protect since I don't know what's going on. And my question is, is how much longer do I give grace and set boundaries before its ultimate, you know, comes down to how do we want to do life moving forward? Speaker 4 (11:22) I think this is going to sound strange because you're called The Ramsey Show. But as Speaker 7 (11:28) I Speaker 4 (11:29) hear you lay out your story, money's a distraction from the real issue. Coming back from a domestic violence separation, the chief objective here is safety. Speaker 1 (11:42) And Speaker 4 (11:43) part of safety is physical. Part of safety is emotional and sexual, right? But part of safety is financial. Speaker 4 (11:52) And you can't pick and choose safety because as Vander Kolk says, your body's keeping the score. So you can't say, I'm not going to put my hands on you anymore, but I'm still going to live my life this way and this way and this way. And you just got to deal with it. Right. That means you're not addressing the full picture of safety. Speaker 5 (12:12) Okay. Speaker 4 (12:13) And so by just choosing to isolate out all the other ways, he's continuing to Speaker 4 (12:21) Gaslight you not tell you the truth live his own life inside of the house y'all share together inside the marriage I'll share together do what he wants to do except just not for this one pretty awful thing and Then it kind of leaves you out to dry to feel crazy about it the more you focus on just that one sliver Your body's gonna continue doing what it's supposed to do Which is ramping up the alarms not letting you sleep at night making you feel unsafe in your own house because you are unsafe in your own house Yeah, Speaker 5 (12:46) I mean Speaker 3 (12:47) Domestic wise, I mean, like I said, God did a huge work. Otherwise, I wouldn't have. He took full responsibility. Apologize. It's just this financial area where he's having a hard time, even with his phone. It's just like this. He hangs on. Like there's these things that he gives bits and pieces. Speaker 5 (13:04) But Speaker 4 (13:05) that tells me he's still being deceptive. And that tells me he's still not ready to fully be your husband. Speaker 3 (13:11) Okay. Speaker 4 (13:12) Okay. And I know that sounds dramatic. And I'm saying it that way intentionally on purpose. Speaker 7 (13:17) Okay. Speaker 4 (13:18) That's not a guy who's interested in doing life with you. It's a guy who's interested in trying to hang on to his marriage and he won't do this other thing anymore. Speaker 5 (13:24) Okay. Speaker 4 (13:25) And so part of you setting the roadmap for here's what it's going to look like for A, us to keep this marriage together and B, you to move back into my home. is I am choosing safety and here's what safety looks like for me. And here's the deal. You get to, you get to lay out what safety looks like. And I'm telling you now, if you're just sitting with thousands of different people, individuals and couples, you're not going to feel safe. If you don't know where the money is, you don't know what he's borrowing, where it's going. You're not going to feel safe. If he flips over a cell phone, every time you walk in the room and how dare you ask for the code of my, of my cell phone, he's not going to feel safe. If he slams the laptop closed every time, right. You know what I'm saying? So you get to, paint the picture of here's what safety is. Now I'm going to tell you the hard part about doing this is you have to have an or what statement on the other end of that. Speaker 4 (14:15) Here's what I'm requesting as like the path back to trust, the path back to us healing our marriage all the way, not just you don't hit me anymore, but all the way is here it is. Here's what safety looks like for me. Are you in? He could say, no, I'm not. I will never get there. And then you have an or what statement. Are you going to say, okay, I'm just going to, this is the marriage I'm choosing. I'm going to. I know for the rest of my life, I'm going to be on my own financially. I'm never going to file taxes. I'm going to keep my own retirement, my own self safe. If you want to make that choice, you're a grown adult and I'll still love you. Still be friends. Or if you say these things happen or the marriage, I'm going to take your signal, your action steps as a language, behavior as a language. I'm going to take your action steps as you've left this marriage. You're no longer interested in being married to me and helping your wife feel safe in her own skin, in her own home. Speaker 5 (15:09) Mm Speaker 7 (15:09) -hmm. Speaker 4 (15:10) Do you know what I'm saying? Speaker 7 (15:12) Yeah. Speaker 4 (15:13) And I know it's harsh. I know it's real direct. But I can feel my own chest tightening up here on your behalf. Speaker 7 (15:20) Yeah. Speaker 4 (15:21) And I don't want any, especially, and again, I've just got a history of sitting with women in this situation. I don't want the super bad thing to not be there anymore and suddenly it wallpapers over all of the other things that make you feel unsafe in your own home. Yeah. All safety matters. And there's no relationship. The baseline for any relationship at all starts with safety and trust. If you don't have those two things, you don't have a true relationship. You might have a co-partnership. You might be able to live autonomous lives right next to each other, real close, even share the same bed, whatever. But you don't have the true foundational relationship unless you have safety and trust. And you don't have either of those things because your husband won't play ball. Speaker 5 (16:06) Yeah, it's hard to not compartmentalize that, but I see what you're saying. Speaker 4 (16:09) I know, but I want you to know your body doesn't compartmentalize it. Speaker 5 (16:14) Right, Speaker 4 (16:14) you're not wrong. Your mind does, but if he pulls into the driveway, does your chest tense up? Not Speaker 5 (16:22) as much as I used to. Speaker 4 (16:23) Okay. I want you to hear your language. Not as much, but yes. Yeah. Right? When the bills come every month, nobody enjoys opening bills, but are you in terror when you tear the bills open? Are you just annoyed? He Speaker 5 (16:39) pays 90 % of them, but yeah. Speaker 4 (16:42) Okay. So all of this, everything I'm telling you is hard. It's scary. It's hard. All of it. I want you to choose the hard path that's going to get you to safety and trust. Speaker 7 (16:52) Yeah. Okay. Speaker 4 (16:54) Cool. All Speaker 7 (16:55) right. Well, thank you. Speaker 4 (16:56) You bet. Speaker 5 (16:57) Man. Speaker 4 (16:57) I'm so sorry, Alyssa. I hate you're Speaker 2 (16:59) in Speaker 4 (16:59) this situation. Actually, Alyssa, hang on the line. I'm going to hook you up with three months free with our friends at BetterHelp. I want you to talk to a licensed professional therapist, and you can start within 24, 48 hours. Somebody will see you. Just so you can have some – they'll be able to walk you through an actual action plan. What's this conversation going to look like? What's an or what statement going to look like? What is managing the response going to look like? I want you to sit with a licensed professional and – they'll be able to see you within 24, 48 hours. So hang on the line here. We'll keep with better help. Speaker 2 (17:27) Man, John, that's a heavy one. I like this method of going, what must be true for Speaker 8 (17:34) this relationship to continue? Most people never get to that point. They just sort of tolerate, they learn a new normal, and they go along to get along. Yeah, Speaker 4 (17:43) I think one of the most heartbreaking statements a person can make, especially inside of a marriage is, this is just the way this is going to be. This is just the way this is. And I always want to shake that snow globe and say, it doesn't have to be right. And that's often forces folks, especially in this situation and say, okay, I don't want it to be like this anymore. And he says, well, I'm not changing. And if that is, I'm, I'm always going to have, I'm not going to, I'm not going to remember to rinse the sink out after I shave. So there's always gonna be a little bitty hairs, right? Some of that you get over, it's annoying and whatever. On big stuff, like, Putting my hands on you big stuff like I'm gonna I'm taking care of the money and you will never know where the money is how much I owe What our situation is how much debt we have how much gambling debt I have how much other addiction debt I have That's it's it's it's tragically unsafe And so if somebody's violated the the fidelity of a marriage right if someone's blown it up Whether through abuse whether through infidelity whether through financial infidelity the person who's aggrieved the person who who says Okay, I want to rebuild trust. They lay out the map. Here's what it's going to take on a weekly basis, then a monthly basis, and then an annual basis. Here's what I want to see. And then the other person's got to say, I'm in or I'm out, right? And that's a tough place to be, especially, like I said, when something so bad has been happening. With that super bad thing's not happening anymore, it's really easy to drop your shoulders and say, I'll deal with all the other bad because this big thing's not happening anymore. And man, I want to call her and her husband. to a better way to live, man. A more peaceful, connected way of doing life. Everything in your life gets better. Whatever you think you're protecting by holding on, not sharing, not being honest, not being vulnerable, not whatever you think you're hiding there, whatever you think you're protecting, I promise you there's more peace on the other side of connectivity and honesty and Speaker 2 (19:37) exhale, right? That's the hardest part of marriage is letting go of those parts and letting someone see it all. See it all. And then... praying, they look across the Speaker 4 (19:47) table and say, and I still choose you. Right. Speaker 6 (20:16) When you take your car to the shop, you're probably thinking two things. How much is this going to cost me? And is it going to get done right? What you need is a mechanic who will give you transparent information so you can make the best decision for your car and your wallet. Christian Brothers Automotive is the official auto repair shop of The Ramsey Show because you can trust them to take care of your vehicle the right way. Their digital vehicle inspections let you see exactly what their technicians see, giving you confidence on which repairs are urgent and which ones can wait. Plus, every repair is backed by their nice difference warranty. Three years or 36,000 miles. With a guarantee like that, you can walk away knowing that your car and your wallet are taken care of. Schedule your service today and get 10 % off your visit at cbac.com slash Ramsey or click the link. in the description. That's CBAC.com slash Ramsey. 10 % off, up to a $250 value. See store for details. Speaker 2 (21:35) Sarah's in Denver up next. Sarah, welcome to The Ramsey Show. Speaker 3 (21:39) Hi, thank you. Speaker 2 (21:41) Absolutely. What's going on? Speaker 8 (21:42) My Speaker 2 (21:42) question Speaker 3 (21:42) is about college saving. Okay. My husband and I have completed Baby Step 4. We have six kids. No savings for college. My oldest is a junior. And we have five of the six kids are going to graduate within six years. Speaker 2 (22:04) Along Speaker 3 (22:05) with that, we know that we have an upcoming medical expense next summer that will be about $40,000 out of pocket. So we are wondering, now that we are fully funded emergency fund, where do we allocate our funds? Like, what is the best way to move forward? Because we don't want to go back into debt. Speaker 4 (22:26) Is there any chance? Y'all have like a, I don't know, I'm thinking like a small tree house in the backyard of your house that might have $2 million under it. No? Like Speaker 3 (22:38) gold mine? Speaker 2 (22:40) Yeah, I was just, I was trying, I was trying. I Speaker 3 (22:42) know. Speaker 2 (22:43) Well, the good news is I don't want you to feel obligated that you have to Speaker 8 (22:47) cash flow every single dollar of every single child's schooling or else you're a bad parent. So you need to prioritize what's happening in your life right now, and that's the medical expense. The other priority is we're not going into debt. And you can hold all of that together. And that means a conversation with every kid. And you're gonna have to do this kid by kid because life could look different six years from now. You might be able to cash flow the last kid's school. And it's not going to feel fair to the one who had to hustle and work three part-time jobs. But the conversation needs to be, hey, kids, we don't have money to cover college. And as a family, a value of ours is we're not going to go into debt to do this. We've seen how it hurts the students. We've seen how it hurts the parents when you take on these Parent PLUS loans. So we need to make a plan for how you guys are all going to get the education that you want or need debt-free. Speaker 8 (23:36) What Speaker 2 (23:37) is their Speaker 3 (23:37) awareness Speaker 2 (23:37) of all that right now? Are they just like, well, mom and dad said we'd figure it out, so we're good? Speaker 3 (23:42) No, they're aware. We talk about it. Speaker 2 (23:44) We Speaker 3 (23:45) do have two adopted, and I don't know if there's anything out there that would help them. But yeah, they're aware that they're going to have to sacrifice. Speaker 4 (23:56) So depending on what state you're in and depending on how the adoption was done, Speaker 4 (24:02) I know in my home state of Texas where I grew up and where I worked, if a kid is adopted in certain trajectories, I mean, their schooling is taken care of. So it'd be worth exploring there in Denver. It may not be the case, but there may be resources there. How old is your second oldest? Speaker 5 (24:20) She's a Speaker 3 (24:22) freshman. Speaker 4 (24:23) Okay, so you have a freshman and a junior? Speaker 3 (24:26) Yep. And then I have three middle schoolers. Speaker 4 (24:28) Okay. I would, I would as quickly as possible, cause we're going to blink and it's going to, the first semester is going to be over. Right. I would, you and your husband get on the same page and I would take your 16 year old out for breakfast somewhere. And just lay it out, lay it out. And if you can do just some cursory inquiries into does Colorado have free community college for two years, like many States do is like bring at least one or two or three options on the table. Speaker 4 (25:01) We are projecting that we might be able to help $500 a month with food or with books or whatever. But just lay it out. The greatest gift you can give this kid right now is honesty. And that way there's... You don't want to, I've been in these, I've been in these conversations with, with families. You don't want this because this conversation is going to happen. You don't want it to happen their second semester of their senior year when all their friends are getting their, their acceptance letters or when your son comes running in the door with an acceptance letter to a college, that's pretty great. But just like Alexis, it's amazing. But if you can't afford it, you can't afford it. And that's Speaker 1 (25:37) a Speaker 4 (25:37) much harder conversation than just laying it out on the front end. And look, if you feel embarrassed, if you feel like this is not what you wished. Like you wish you could just write checks for their college. Tell them that. Okay. This is not how we drew this up. It's not how we would have designed it. This is us owning reality and wanting to walk alongside you. And we're going to plead with you to not take out student loans. Speaker 3 (25:56) Okay. extra funds we have now, we should just put in a savings account for that medical bill. Speaker 2 (26:02) Absolutely, 100%. And not Speaker 3 (26:04) even think about college until that's paid for. Speaker 2 (26:08) That medical bill sounds like it's the priority. You know it's happening. You know the dollar amount. You know it's going to be out of pocket. I Speaker 4 (26:13) mean, unless you'll make a quarter million dollars or 500 grand a year and you're going to have extra on top of the 40,000. Speaker 2 (26:19) No. Okay. How much do you guys make? I wish. Speaker 3 (26:24) I'm a stay-at-home mom. My husband's a primary care physician, so he makes about $300,000. Great. So Speaker 2 (26:30) you guys might figure out in the budget, hey, as this goes on, we can start to budget for this and allocate, I don't know, Speaker 8 (26:37) $50,000 per year in a high-yield savings account for college. And then that means that's the budget for that kid coming up. And if they can get scholarships, they can get grants, they can work part time to supplement all of that. But the goal is we are not going into debt. So we got to figure out a plan, which means we're not going to go shopping at the Porsche dealership. We're not going to go to the big name brand schools touring across the country because then that school down the road from you is going to seem like you're just getting a Kia Sorento comparatively. And so you want to make sure that you're very clear that we're not just carte blanche. You can go wherever you want. The world is not your oyster in this case. The world is, hey, you don't even know what you want to do, really. So let's just knock out our gen eds at the local community college. And it's not a less than experience. The education has come such a long way that community college is on par with the state schools and the state schools are on par with some of the private school education. So they're going to be OK. They're still going to have their hopes and dreams fulfilled. It just may not look like that out of state across the country school that costs 50 grand a semester. Speaker 4 (27:37) And if making 300 grand, if. after you get this medical expense taken care of, y'all are able to even cash flow $1,500 a month, $2,000 a month, and you and your husband can make a budget and project out that far. That's great. That's awesome. You can start every semester, you can put that semester on a payment plan with the school and not take out a student loan, and you can pay it monthly. And so maybe y'all are able to help in that way. I don't know how it all trickles down after you got six kids there, but and what you're... Life expenditures are in your cars and your home. I don't know all that y'all you and your husband to figure that out I'll also tell you this here's what I do with my kid my I have a 16 year old who's a junior my wife and I sat him down this summer and It his mom and I my wife and I are nerds like that's no surprise We made a pretty complex spreadsheet that basically laid out here are some schools I would love you to go to and Here's what percentage of those schools I'll pay for Speaker 4 (28:37) But the big thing I put in his lap was, if you get X, Y, or Z on the ACT or the SAT, which by the way, that test in of itself does not matter, but that score has a dollar amount to it. That's just part of playing this game. I will pay for prep courses. I will pay for tutoring support. But if you get this particular score on this test, I'll write you this big of a check on your graduation day. Right. And what I'm doing is I'm putting some of the onus on him. You're going to self-select out of certain schools. And there's certain bands of schools that my wife and I told him, you can go to them. We will pay zero dollars. Right. So you're going to be earning every bit of this on your own. But we were real clear, just laid it out. But I wanted to give him as much responsibility as possible. And what a junior can own right now is making their full time job outside of school, studying for one of these standardized tasks. Speaker 1 (29:37) Yeah. Speaker 2 (29:39) The other thing to think about is not every kid may want to go to college. Right. Have that conversation too. There could be trade schools, associate degrees, certificate programs. They might be entrepreneurial. Speaker 8 (29:49) And so that's the good news is we don't have to figure this all out today. So let's just kind of like the debt snowball. We're focusing on the smallest debt. Let's just focus on the Speaker 2 (29:57) oldest kid, see where their heart is, what their mind is, when it comes to further education, and then let's make a plan around that. Speaker 8 (30:06) And Speaker 2 (30:06) for that 11-year-old, you may set up a 529 and go, hey, we got seven plus years to fund this thing. We can Speaker 8 (30:12) invest the money and have it grow for us. Let compound growth do a little bit of the lifting. And you might have some state tax benefits as well with that. So there are a ton of options, but the homework I would give to you guys is do like a family movie night and go watch Borrowed Future. This is our documentary on the student loan crisis. And what will it do? It'll open their eyes to what's actually happening in higher ed and open their eyes to all of the possibilities and solutions there are to avoid what is this one point seven plus trillion dollar crisis where everyone's gone. Nobody told me this is you telling them this is your way of opening up that conversation to where you don't have to start it. That will start it for them. They'll be asking questions by the end of it. And you'll see our friend Dr. John Deloney in there as well. Speaker 6 (31:22) If your business is making seven figures or more, you should be proud of that. But that growth probably brought a mess with it. Systems that don't talk to each other. It's impossible to track down your numbers because they're scattered everywhere. That's a visibility problem, and NetSuite has solved that problem for more than 44,000 businesses like yours. NetSuite brings financials, inventory, CRM, and more into one place. And their AI tool, NetSuite Next. builds AI into everything, automating busy work like forecasting demand and chasing down overdue accounts. It's not complicated to use. You