Tori Kelly | "We Don't Know How to Package You"

The Person Who Believed In Me with David Begnaud

Tori Kelly shares her journey from a shy child with a powerful voice to a Grammy-winning artist, highlighting how Polly Anthony, the first w

Key takeaways

• Polly Anthony's belief in Tori Kelly at age 12 was transformative, offering validation when she doubted whether anyone would truly understand her talent.
• Tori emphasizes that authenticity mattered more than fitting a mold—Polly embraced her as she was, unlike other industry figures who pushed for changes.

Main topics

• Early career beginnings
• The impact of mentorship from Polly Anthony

Notable quotes

"I remember meeting Pauly and she immediately just made me feel so comfortable and safe."

"Up until this point, will anyone understand me?"

Conclusion

Tori Kelly's story underscores the profound impact of early belief and

Transcript preview

Speaker 2 (0:00) Grammy Award winner who's been sharing her voice since she was a kid. Speaker 1 (0:03) She gained traction on YouTube. Hands down, one of the best voices of this generation. Miss Tori Kelly. I just thought up until this point, will anyone understand me? I remember meeting Pauly and she immediately just made me feel so comfortable and safe. People were always saying, oh, you're just one hit away. You're so close. Close to what, though? And the mic is good here? Yeah. So official. I love it. Speaker 2 (0:33) Yeah, we have a great space. Yeah, I'm a big fan, by the way. Great space. Really Speaker 1 (0:37) honored to be on your show. Thank you very much. You are Speaker 2 (0:39) – I'm glad to have you. Honestly, I spent a lot of time in Tori Kelly land. Speaker 1 (0:44) Yeah, doing your research. In both Speaker 2 (0:46) the music and the research and also the difference between, you know, the most recent music. I mean, I was listening to Ocean a little while ago. Ocean, yeah, yeah. Right? Okay. And Speaker 1 (0:57) so Speaker 2 (0:57) just like there's – I like the diversity to even, you know, one sounds poppy. Yeah. One has the R &B. Then you have the gospel. CeCe Winans is coming in. Love. I'm such a huge fan. Speaker 1 (1:09) Love her. Like when I tell you I'm a Speaker 2 (1:11) big fan. Oh, my gosh. Oh, my gosh. CeCe Winans makes me. Speaker 1 (1:15) That's exciting. Speaker 2 (1:16) Okay. Are we ready? Yeah, we're Speaker 1 (1:17) ready. Speaker 2 (1:17) All right. Here we go. Ready? Speaker 1 (1:18) Cool. Speaker 2 (1:19) Okay. So what we do is I'll start with an intro. That'll lead right into the conversation. Perfect. I'll pick up where you leave off, and I'm glad you're here. Okay, here we go. Three, two, and one. Welcome to The Person Who Believed in Me. I'm David Begnaud. Tori Kelly took an album to number two on the Billboard 200 and won three Grammy Awards. But before any of that, she was a shy girl wondering if she had what it took to be a star. She was a kid that the industry would reject again and again. Then she met a woman named Polly Anthony. Polly was the first woman to run a major record label, and Polly signed her at 12 years old and really validated exactly who she was. The rest is a decades-long journey of re-invention all the way to making the most personal music of her life. Please welcome to the show, Tori Kelly. Speaker 1 (2:10) Hi. Speaker 2 (2:10) Good to have you. Speaker 1 (2:11) Thanks for having me. So let Speaker 2 (2:13) us begin as we always do. Speaker 1 (2:15) Oh my gosh. Wow. Crazy. Speaker 1 (2:21) Who is that? Rest in peace. Polly Anthony. Speaker 2 (2:25) She is the person you say believed in you. Tell me how. Speaker 1 (2:31) So I first met Polly. I was 12 years old and I had, I had been on a TV show called America's Most Talented Kids. And I feel like, well, before that I was on a few other shows. Star Search was another one, but I was just kind of. singing, you know, doing my thing. And then that show is where I started getting some people in the industry paying attention. And one thing led to another. I got brought into Polly's office and she was the head executive at Geffen Records. And so this was, you know, I feel like now it's different. But back then. you know, walking into a record label was like, this is everything. You're also a child. I'm Speaker 2 (3:25) a Speaker 1 (3:25) child, a literal child. It's so weird looking back at photos and stuff at that time. So I'm like, I was literally a baby. But yeah, it was such a big deal. I remember meeting Polly and she immediately just made me feel so comfortable and safe. And she had this warmth about her. And she was so... like maternal, I felt like towards me. And, and I was talking to my mom about it too. I was like, do you have any memories of, of that time? She was like, I just remember how sweet she was to all of us. Like my whole family walked in and, you know, it was me, my brother, my two parents. And, you know, obviously since I'm 12, it's kind of like a package deal, right? And they're not just gonna drop me off at this label. So she was just so welcoming to all of us. And She, yeah, she just, she believed in me from the start. I always felt that way. Speaker 2 (4:16) It's worth noting that by the time you met Polly, you had already been on American Idol. Is that correct? Speaker 1 (4:21) So, no, actually. So I was on, I was on Star Search. How did that go? When Speaker 2 (4:28) I was 10. Speaker 1 (4:29) That went, how far did I make it? I definitely didn't win. I think I won like the first round. And then I went up against David Archuleta. Right. And he beat me. Speaker 1 (4:40) But yeah, I did Star Search and then I did America's Most Talented Kids. How did Speaker 2 (4:44) that go? Speaker 1 (4:45) Also didn't win. Speaker 2 (4:46) The reason I keep asking how did it go is by the time you walked in Polly's office, you had not had any big wins or successes. Speaker 1 (4:54) No. Yeah, correct. Speaker 2 (4:55) The reality of her, an executive of her kind, Speaker 1 (4:59) the Speaker 2 (4:59) head of this label, believing in you at 12 years old was, if I'm not mistaken. The first time someone had seriously believed in you. Speaker 1 (5:08) Definitely. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, because I think up until this point, I believed in myself to an extent, but I knew that I could sing well just because I believed my parents. My parents were my biggest fans. They, you know, both of them. Speaker 1 (5:29) into music. My dad's a musician and he sings. So I knew that because they were so supportive and, you know, telling me that I was doing great, I believed that. And so I think I just thought up until this point, will anyone understand me? I think that was what I wanted, you know, when I really think about. what was my desire back then. I think I just wanted to be understood because I knew that I could get people's attention with my talent, but I didn't know if that was enough. Speaker 2 (6:03) You could tell that Polly was really a fan of your voice. Yeah. You weren't just this cute kid. She saw some real opportunity in there, right? So you're 12 years old. She signs you. You're in the room. You expect this sort of scary, cold industry, and Polly really shatters that. Right. You compared yourself at the time to the bubbly Disney kids. Yeah. Right. A lot of people wanted you also, even at that age, to change, tweak some things. Speaker 1 (6:31) Yeah. Speaker 2 (6:32) Right. Yeah. Speaker 1 (6:33) I think people were just the sense that I got when people looked at me. I felt like I could almost read their minds. It was almost like they were seeing all this talent. Like, wow, great voice. But how do we. package that? How do we sell that? On Speaker 2 (6:49) the flip side, Polly seemed to embrace you exactly as you were. Speaker 1 (6:54) Yeah. Yeah. I never felt from her that she was, you know, suggesting things to change or none of that. You don't need to be more outgoing. Speaker 2 (7:05) Yeah. Yeah. Speaker 1 (7:06) I never felt that from her. Later on, not too much later, but I, you know, I would end up eventually, you know, meeting with other labels and I, and I. always felt that I wasn't being enough or wasn't, you know, outgoing enough or bubbly enough. And I never felt that from her. She always made me feel really comfortable just as I was. Did Speaker 2 (7:27) you understand at 12 years old that this major executive had walked you into her office to sign you? No. You didn't? Speaker 1 (7:34) No. I mean, I think I knew that it was a big deal because it was a record label. And that just at the time, that was just, you know. what you did to make it. There was no posting videos or anything. How Speaker 2 (7:46) many years have you been working on your craft before Polly signed you? Speaker 1 (7:51) It sounds kind of crazy, but I think vocally there was not really a start time. So I would say 12 years, 10, 12 years, but at least, you know, from, from a vocal standpoint, I think my, my parents even said, you know, I was singing ever since I could talk, I was working on how to do melodies and, um, things like that. But I think probably around six years old is when I actually started performing on stages. Speaker 2 (8:17) Where did she discover you? Speaker 1 (8:19) It's a little. Speaker 1 (8:22) It's blurry thinking back to like the exact way that she discovered me, but I'm almost positive it was from that show, the America's Most Talented Kids. I think someone saw me on that and then essentially had connections to different labels and brought me in to, yeah, to meet with her. And then she liked what she saw apparently. Speaker 2 (8:45) This is you. Speaker 1 (8:46) Yeah, that was the show. America's Most Speaker 2 (8:48) Talented Kids, 2004, age 11. Speaker 1 (8:50) Yeah. Speaker 2 (8:52) Take me back to this day, that kid, looking at this picture. Describe this kid for me. Speaker 1 (8:57) It's so trippy seeing this photo. Okay, this kid was very, very shy. I just remember being, yeah, she was so shy, but she loved to sing. And she just wanted. She just wanted to be heard. I think she just wanted to be on stage, getting people to feel things, getting people to hear, you know, what she had to say. Speaker 1 (9:28) And yeah, wow. Here's an honest question. Can you be Speaker 2 (9:30) a superstar and be shy? Speaker 1 (9:32) I think yes, absolutely. I didn't believe that at the time. But I mean, we see it all the time. I mean, look at Michael Jackson even. Like there's so many. I think even Beyonce has said that she's, you know, there's the Sasha Fierce and then there's kind of the shy. I didn't believe that though. Are you shy Speaker 2 (9:51) on stage or just more shy in a room of five people? Speaker 1 (9:55) Well, at the time, I was definitely just shy across the board. I did not know how to perform yet. I didn't know. I mean, when I watched that video back, though, there is definitely this confidence, I think, that's trying to sort of bubble up to the surface. But I still wasn't ready to unleash that yet. I think now I've figured out how to. I'm still shy, but I figured out, I think, how to let loose more on stage. Speaker 2 (10:20) You are a three-time Grammy-winning singer-songwriter whose career, I'd say, is really a textbook study in patience, reinvention, and some pretty strong conviction. Yeah. Would you agree with that? Speaker 1 (10:35) Yeah, definitely. Speaker 2 (10:37) Did you dream of winning a Grammy? Speaker 1 (10:40) Oh, yeah. Yeah. I remember being a kid and watching the Grammys. I actually think I dreamt of winning a Grammy. just as much as I dreamt of performing at the Grammys, actually. For me, that was like a, I don't know, I just wanted to be on the biggest stages possible. Speaker 2 (10:59) Have you performed at the Grammys? I have. When? I Speaker 1 (11:01) have, and that felt amazing. It was the first year that I was nominated as Best New Artist in 2016, and I got to perform with James Bay. It was so cool. Speaker 2 (11:12) Let's do some quick stats on your background. So, born Victoria Loren. Kelly. Nice. Speaker 1 (11:19) You got the pronunciation. I love Speaker 2 (11:20) that middle name. Speaker 1 (11:21) Thank you. Speaker 2 (11:21) Born December 14th. You are married to a former pro basketball player, Andre. Speaker 1 (11:27) You Speaker 2 (11:28) guys have, I'll call him an almost brand new baby boy, Zayden. I know. Speaker 1 (11:32) It's weird. We can't say brand new anymore. Speaker 2 (11:35) He is such a little lump of love. I'm telling you. You have what we would call in Louisiana where I grew up a little gumbo of. Speaker 2 (11:44) Ethnic heritage. Yeah. Your dad is Afro-Jamaican and Puerto Rican. Speaker 1 (11:48) Yeah. Speaker 2 (11:49) Mom is Irish and German. You have won three Grammys. Two were in 2019 for gospel, and a third was for best arrangement, right? Acapella. You're currently signed at Epic Records. You were signed at Geffen by Polly at age 12. Speaker 1 (12:08) I Speaker 2 (12:08) didn't know that you were the voice of Mina the Elephant in Sing 1 and 2. Speaker 1 (12:13) Yes. Fun fact. Who Speaker 2 (12:14) knew? So Polly signs you, but not long after. And you said at the top, we should say, you said rest in peace. Polly sadly died of pancreatic cancer. Speaker 1 (12:25) But Speaker 2 (12:26) before her death, she ended up moving on to another position inside the label. And someone new stepped in. At this time, you're 13 years old. And everything changes. Tell me how. Speaker 1 (12:40) Yeah, I felt the immediate shift when Pauly stepped out of that position. And I don't know all the details of why or, you know, she moved positions, but someone else stepped in. And, you know, they, of course, inherited all the artists that were there. So looking back, I wouldn't have expected him to be as... passionate, you know, because he's not the one who actually signed me. Polly was, you know, I was like her passion project, I feel like. And so, yeah, there just immediately was this shift. There wasn't as much excitement. You know, he had his artist that he wanted to focus on. And it sort of boiled down to, you know, we had a few meetings and it just wasn't feeling right. And I'm really grateful that I had my parents. alongside of me at that time because they sort of helped me make that decision of like, let's ask to leave because we got the sense that they were just going to shelve me. And, you know, they made comments like, oh, what if we wait a few years? You know, when you're 16, it'll be easier to market you and it's more appealing. And we were like, it doesn't really feel like that's what I want to do. We might as well leave and I can. you know, be a normal kid for a second. Speaker 2 (14:07) Devil's advocate question. You're only 13. Yeah. Speaker 1 (14:10) You Speaker 2 (14:10) don't have a lot of experience in the industry. Why not trust them? Speaker 1 (14:14) I think it was looking back, I really feel like it was this gut feeling. And I asked myself, you know, was I just following along with what my parents wanted? And maybe there's an aspect to that because I am so young, of course, and I did and still do really trust their judgment. But I felt it too. I think walking in that room, those few meetings I took, I was like, something just doesn't, this doesn't feel like where I'm supposed to be. When Speaker 2 (14:41) Polly was in charge, what did she do? Just bullet point for me. Were there any big successes or opportunities she gave you in that year she was on the role? Speaker 1 (14:49) So nothing, no music ever came out from that time. But she was, you know, putting me in the studio with all the big, like the. biggest names, the biggest producers. I have, I actually have so many songs just like in the vault from that time that are just, I wonder sometimes if they came out. Don't tease us Tori, that's Speaker 2 (15:11) amazing. Speaker 1 (15:11) Maybe one day I'll leak them. But she, yeah, she was just, she was really involved. And I think one, she wanted to, you know, try different things. And she, at one point she even had me sing a cover of Vision of Love. by Mariah Carey. I think she, she would say, you know, I, I think your, your vocals are up there, you know, with at, at that level. And I, I feel like maybe if you do this cover and people can hear, you know, some of the similarities, which is, is crazy for her to say that, like she was just really championing me. And yeah, like I said, no music ever came out, but she was very involved and active in just trying to set me up with the right producers. Speaker 2 (15:51) 16 years old. Speaker 1 (15:53) This is so great. Speaker 2 (15:54) American Idol. Yeah. Speaker 1 (15:55) So Speaker 2 (15:55) you go on American Idol, you audition for season nine and you were cut before the top 24. Yes. Simon Cowell called your voice almost annoying. Speaker 1 (16:08) Yeah, almost. Speaker 2 (16:09) Almost. Almost. Not annoying, but almost. Yeah, not quite. How did it feel to hear that then? Speaker 1 (16:16) From Simon? Yeah. You know, it's funny. I've been asked this and I don't know if I was just, because I got the yeses, right, from everyone else. And I felt like Simon saying no was almost this afterthought. Like when I was in that room, I felt like I had it. I was like, okay, this is going my way. They're into it. And so I got yes, yes, yes. And when he said no, I was kind of like. okay, whatever. And I just sort of left it at that because I was like, I made it, I'm in. So it was so interesting. I mean, I think, I think I can say this now at this point being this far removed from