Vicki Lawrence | The Magnificent Others with Billy Corgan

The Magnificent Others with Billy Corgan

Comedienne Vicki Lawrence shares her journey from an 18-year-old UCLA student to a cast member of The Carol Burnett Show, reflecting on her

Key takeaways

• Lawrence's career began with a serendipitous fan letter that led to her casting on The Carol Burnett Show.
• Harvey Korman played a pivotal role in shaping her comedic style and character development.

Main topics

• The Carol Burnett Show
• Mama character evolution

Notable quotes

"We really never, I don't remember ever having a stressful day."

Conclusion

Vicki Lawrence's story underscores how authenticity, mentorship, and t

Transcript preview

Speaker 3 (0:00) I think the parents and the grandparents, they're passing those shows on because they were harmless, they were fun. It was, I always, it's kind of like you get to laugh for no good reason. Speaker 2 (0:09) It's a gentler time in sort of American comedy and there's a sweetness to the thing that I particularly miss. Speaker 3 (0:16) We had so much fun on that show and I have never been on another Speaker 2 (0:20) show like it. What do you think is the sort of the secret sauce on that as somebody who saw it up close? Speaker 3 (0:25) I mean, we really never, I don't remember ever having a stressful day. Speaker 2 (0:29) You're an OG guy. Vicki Lawrence, thank you so much for being here. Thank you for having me. Where do we begin on this crazy journey that you've taken through life? I Speaker 3 (0:42) know, I'm Speaker 2 (0:42) old. Speaker 3 (0:42) It's a long time ago. Last century. Speaker 2 (0:47) See, the thing is, because my generation grew up with you on television, I think we assumed you were older than you were. But when you were on television, you were very young. Speaker 3 (0:57) I was 18 when I started. Crazy. Yeah. Speaker 2 (1:02) So that takes us to the perfect moment in time. You were voted in high school most likely to succeed. Speaker 3 (1:12) I Speaker 2 (1:12) was very Speaker 3 (1:12) busy in high school. I was very busy. I was a cheerleader. I did all the choreography for all the dance numbers. I Speaker 2 (1:19) was in every Speaker 3 (1:20) singing group on campus. I was busy. Did Speaker 2 (1:23) you have the showbiz gene or you had the performer gene? Because it's kind of different. Or both. Speaker 3 (1:28) I don't, you know, I lived in Inglewood, close proximity to Hollywood. Yeah. But it never occurred to me to go into show business. It never just, I mean, I guess I thought it would never. Speaker 2 (1:41) No. I was going Speaker 3 (1:42) to be a dental hygienist. Speaker 2 (1:43) I know. I saw that. So did the Young Americans singing group, whatever extravaganza that was, that came before Miss Fireball? Do I have the sequence right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I started Speaker 3 (1:55) in the Young Americans my freshman year. I entered New School and entered the choir class. And in walks this... incredibly unattractive guy who starts talking about being on the road last summer with Johnny Mathis. And I'm like, what the heck is he doing? Well, it turns out it was the Young Americans. So the next time there were auditions, I said, I can do that. The Speaker 2 (2:21) Young Americans is still Speaker 1 (2:22) going, which is remarkable. Speaker 2 (2:24) Yeah, but Speaker 3 (2:25) you know, I feel like I got to do it in a really fun time. Well, Speaker 2 (2:29) you got to do it in the kind of the idyllic Disney kind of time where there was a movie or in the movie. Can you tell people what the Young Americans was? Because It's hard to even understand what it would be. It still exists, but it sort of seems anachronistic to today's society. Speaker 3 (2:42) It was all high schoolers. You had to have a B, at least a B average. You had to be musical. You had to pass like sort of a musical audition. And it was all students. And we had so much fun. I mean, we used to do the Hollywood Palace, Jog Your Memories Kids. We did sing with Johnny Mathis. We got to do all the background vocals for Henry Mancini when he was at the Greek Theater. That's cool. I saw Speaker 2 (3:14) Andy Williams' show. Speaker 3 (3:15) The Andy Williams' show. Yeah, Speaker 2 (3:17) it Speaker 3 (3:17) was really Speaker 2 (3:17) fun. Do Speaker 3 (3:18) you Speaker 2 (3:18) actually travel with that thing? Yeah. Speaker 3 (3:20) How Speaker 2 (3:21) were your parents with all that? Did they sort of encourage the showbiz thing? Yeah, Speaker 3 (3:25) my mom did, for sure. Did Speaker 2 (3:27) she see something in you that made sense to her that you would want that, or was it just like a fun thing? Speaker 3 (3:33) You know, I don't know. I think she wanted to be a performer herself. The story she always told us was that she sang with a little, a small group of guys. I guess there were three guys and my mom. And they wanted to go off to New York and try to make it. And she wanted to go and her mom said, no, you're not going. So I think, yeah, she pushed a little bit. Speaker 2 (4:01) Did you play the Illinois State Penitentiary? I saw that. Speaker 3 (4:04) Yeah, that was in the movie. Yes. Speaker 2 (4:08) Just the idea of these fresh-faced California kids coming in. I Speaker 3 (4:12) know. Speaker 2 (4:12) It Speaker 3 (4:12) was kind of Speaker 2 (4:13) trippy. Facing the hardened criminals. Yeah. Were you at the premiere on August 21st, 1967, which I believe was held like in Kansas or something. Was Speaker 3 (4:22) that... The Speaker 2 (4:23) premiere for the movie. Speaker 3 (4:24) No, I don't think I was. The Speaker 2 (4:25) movie's online. Which is kind of interesting. Speaker 3 (4:27) I know. Have you gone and looked at it? I have gone and watched it. Because when I talk about Carol, people always ask me if I studied her. And I said, I never studied her at all. But I went back and looked at that documentary. And I was kind of geeky and gawky like a young Carol. Speaker 2 (4:43) Yeah. Yeah. And then the craziest part of that whole thing is that movie won an Oscar. Speaker 3 (4:50) Yes. And then Speaker 2 (4:51) they took it away. Speaker 3 (4:52) Yes. Speaker 2 (4:54) Which is like, couldn't they figure it out? Because the reason they took it away was technically the movie wasn't legal for the time that it won or something. Because of Speaker 3 (5:02) our cinematographer, I think. Something where Speaker 2 (5:04) it came out or something. That's the story online. It came out and they realized later that it didn't fit the window for viability. So then they took the Oscar away from you guys. Oh, okay. Speaker 3 (5:14) I didn't know it was a window. I thought it was one of our cameramen. Speaker 2 (5:16) Maybe that's the secret story. Speaker 3 (5:19) I don't know. Maybe it was a moral Speaker 2 (5:20) issue. Speaker 2 (5:24) So, yeah. So then there's this Miss Fireball, which, you know, I love this word apocryphal. It's the kind of the apocryphal moment in your life because this whole sequence of events leads to you being on The Carol Burnett Show. So I know you've told that story 500 times. So if you want to tell the condensed version, I'm OK with it. But I just find it so interesting. Speaker 3 (5:42) You Speaker 2 (5:42) know, the idea of fate is such an interesting thing. Speaker 3 (5:45) Yeah, I guess so. I used to enter everything, every contest that came around. I guess I was bored. I don't know. I would just enter contests. And so this one came up, and it was a fireman's ball. And they decided to call it a contest and maybe get some young girls to come out and dance and sing for them. And I was one of eight girls. And our newspaper gal did a big article about two weeks prior to the contest. And in the newspaper, she said, I bore a striking resemblance to a young Carol Burnett. And my mom said, you need to write her a fan letter. Speaker 3 (6:25) And as I said, I had never studied her. I was aware of her. I saw her. I saw the TV version of Once Upon a Mattress that they did. So I saw that. She Speaker 2 (6:36) was Speaker 3 (6:36) kind Speaker 2 (6:36) of on. This is before the Carol Burnett show. She was kind of on television in little roles and guest things. On Speaker 3 (6:42) and off. She was kind of a Speaker 2 (6:43) known personality, but she wasn't yet like a star. Speaker 3 (6:45) No, she wasn't not a star. She had a brief series that she co-hosted with Bob Newhart called The Entertainers. and John Davidson was their little resident singer, and I had a crush on him, so I did watch that show a little bit, but I wasn't watching Carol. He Speaker 2 (7:01) was handsome. Speaker 3 (7:01) I was watching John. Speaker 2 (7:03) Yeah. Speaker 1 (7:05) Anyway, so I, yeah, Speaker 3 (7:07) I wrote her a fan letter. I used to write a lot of fan letters, but it was always to all the cute young guys that were on television. I just, I told her I would like to meet her. Didn't really ask for anything. Everybody says I look like you. And I mailed it off to Carol. Did Speaker 2 (7:24) you Speaker 3 (7:24) include Speaker 2 (7:24) the newspaper? Yes, I put the Speaker 3 (7:26) newspaper article in so she could see that I wasn't nuts. And she managed to get the letter before the contest. Actually, her cousin was her secretary at the time. Cuz, she always called her Cuz. She said, Cuz called me in my office and said, you need to read this fan letter. Speaker 3 (7:49) She took my dad's name out of the newspaper article, looked us up in the phone book, which nobody even knows about anymore. And she called me after school. That's a crazy story. I know. It's pretty crazy. Because your whole life Speaker 2 (8:04) literally goes in this direction because of this one thing. Speaker 3 (8:08) Uh-huh. Yeah. And she had to talk her husband into coming to the contest. She said, I want to go see it. And Speaker 2 (8:14) she was very pregnant at the time. Yes. As the story goes. Speaker 3 (8:16) Yeah. And her husband said, what is she? It was at Hollywood Park. It was at the racetrack, which is now SoFi Stadium. Wow. But back in the day, you know, it was a thoroughbred horse racing track. Speaker 3 (8:30) Her husband said to her on the way down, what the hell is she, a jockey? And she said, just I have a hunch. I want to go to this contest. I'm pregnant. Indulge me. So she asked for two seats way in the back. She said, I will just sneak in. And then I'll call you in a couple of weeks and we'll have lunch and discuss your career, sweetie. And I thought, okay, well, she's out of her mind. Speaker 2 (8:55) The Speaker 3 (8:56) whole thing was just so surreal. Speaker 2 (8:58) Did you win Miss Fireball? I Speaker 3 (9:00) did. Speaker 2 (9:00) I Speaker 3 (9:01) did. And she crowned me. Speaker 2 (9:03) They Speaker 3 (9:04) asked her to come up and crown the winner. Is there a picture of that moment? Speaker 1 (9:06) Oh, Speaker 3 (9:07) God, yes. So amazing. We went backstage after the contest and took some pictures with the mayor and I think maybe with the fire chief. And she said, I will be in touch. And that was it. That was November of my senior year. January of my senior year, I came home from school and my mom said, Carol just had that baby. And she is at St. John's in Santa Monica. So I guess my mom really did kind of push, didn't she? And I was on my way to a recording session with the Young Americans. So I said to the guy that I was ride sharing with, I said, I want to stop by the hospital and say hi. And he said, you're not going to get in to see Carol Burnett. And I said, well, I. I'm going to try. I know her married name. So I'm going to try. So we go into St. John's maternity ward, third floor. I go up. There's two nurses sitting behind the nurse's station. It's very quiet. There's nothing going on. And as politely as I could, I said, I'm here to see Mrs. Hamilton. And they looked at me and they said, oh, my God, you must be her sister, Chrissy. Speaker 3 (10:13) why don't you see the baby? They took me right into her room. Speaker 2 (10:16) So, Speaker 3 (10:16) yeah. And nowadays I would probably be arrested, but. Was Speaker 2 (10:19) Carol okay with you? She Speaker 3 (10:21) was fine. I had dinner with her about a couple of weeks ago and her husband said, weren't you, how did you feel when this girl walked in your Speaker 1 (10:30) hospital room? Were you happy to Speaker 2 (10:32) see her? Carol Speaker 3 (10:33) said, I was, I was very happy to see her. Speaker 2 (10:36) And to be. I Speaker 3 (10:37) guess so. Not to be. Yeah. Speaker 2 (10:39) I mean, what a... So Carol Burnett's show starts in 1967, runs through 78. There's other stuff that happens, but that's essentially the core show. 70 Emmy nominations, 125, 279 total episodes of that run. you're the only talent that lasted all 11 years. And I didn't know, because I, maybe because of the way it worked back then, I remember more so, of course, the Tim Conway being part of the show. But the original show, maybe because of the syndication, the original show was Lyle Wagner, you, Harvey Korman, and Kara was the core cast. Speaker 3 (11:15) That was the original cast, yeah. And that was like, Speaker 2 (11:17) for like the first five, seven years, that was the kind of core cast of the show. Speaker 3 (11:20) Yeah. Speaker 2 (11:22) I read somewhere Lyle was up for Batman, did get Batman. Lyle Speaker 3 (11:25) left in the seventh season to go be Wonder Woman's leading lady. Speaker 2 (11:32) But you know, he lost to Adam West for Batman. Did you know that? Speaker 3 (11:36) Yes, but he was Wonder Speaker 2 (11:38) Woman. Speaker 3 (11:38) Could have been a different history there with Batman. Well, I'll tell you an interesting history about Lyle, who was, he was a clever guy. He, after... He left the Burnett Show and we worked at CBS. So the whole everything was under one roof. Your dressing rooms, the commissary. This is TV City. Yes. Which is now going to Speaker 2 (12:00) be condos now or something, right? Speaker 3 (12:01) I hope not. I hope they don't take it away. I did something there recently. I think they still kind of Speaker 1 (12:05) use it. Speaker 3 (12:07) Dancing with the Stars is there. Yeah, but isn't Speaker 2 (12:10) the plan they're going to turn into like all condos or something? Speaker 3 (12:12) Well, I've heard that. Yeah. Speaker 2 (12:13) I Speaker 3 (12:13) hope they don't tear it down. Speaker 2 (12:14) Because Speaker 3 (12:15) I feel like it's kind of... No, I think Speaker 2 (12:16) they're not going to tear it down. I think the idea is it won't be a TV thing anymore, per se. They're going Speaker 3 (12:20) to make the studio condos? Speaker 2 (12:22) Something like that. Speaker 3 (12:23) Worst elevator in the world. People are not going to like it. Anyway, Speaker 2 (12:29) he Speaker 3 (12:30) went over to Universal to do Wonder Woman. It's a film lot, so he had a trailer, which was outside of the stage. And he went to his bosses and said, I really, I hate that trailer. If I were to design my own trailer and use it, would you rent it from me? And they said, sure, no problem. And that's how Star Wagons started. Speaker 2 (12:54) Oh, he started that? Speaker 3 (12:55) He is Star Wagons. Wow. Wagons with two Gs, just like Wagoner. And yeah, you see him everywhere. Speaker 2 (13:03) Richer than hell. I've been in a star wagon a few times. Left Speaker 3 (13:06) his business to his sons who run it. Speaker 1 (13:08) God bless. Speaker 3 (13:09) Yeah. Speaker 2 (13:12) There's so many. It strikes me because I get these kind of questions where it's like everybody has their specific memories. And I'm not assuming it's all a blur for you, but I mean, a lot of it's going to be a blur with all that work. Speaker 3 (13:23) Yeah. Is that Speaker 2 (13:24) fair? I mean, yeah. I'm sure there's a lot of things people mention to you and you think like, I kind of remember that. Yeah, Speaker 3 (13:30) but it's another lifetime, really. That's true. Speaker 2 (13:32) Yeah. So I guess my point of entry is like. I mean, here you are. You're not, I mean, you basically were plucked out of high school, essentially, right? Were you still in high school when you started on the show? Speaker 3 (13:44) I was. I met her November of my senior year. That's crazy. And I started on the show the same fall that I started at UCLA. Speaker 2 (13:52) So like, boom. And they said, Speaker 3 (13:54) you may go to college, but we need you here at the studio at seven, or I'm sorry, at 10, every day. Speaker 1 (14:00) And Speaker 3 (14:00) so I took every course you could take at seven. Or 8 or 9 o'clock. And then I was off to the store. I really had no college life. Speaker 2 (14:09) Yeah. Speaker 3 (14:10) But how Speaker 2 (14:11) did you, gosh, I don't know how, everybody projects their own feelings into these things, so I'm asking you, obviously. But it's like, how did it feel to suddenly you're on national television? Speaker 3 (14:21) Bizarre. I think I would watch the episodes like that when they were on the air. It was like watching a horrible home movie to me. Speaker 2 (14:31) Yeah. Speaker 3 (14:33) Yeah, I was kind of geeky and awkward. What do you Speaker 2 (14:37) think, I mean, besides the implication of physical resemblance, what do you think Carol saw in you? Something, right? I Speaker 3 (14:46) have no idea. I mean, I tell her all the time, I thank you for my life. Really? And she says, it would have happened anyway, sweetie. There is a Speaker 2 (14:57) faded feeling to the whole thing, for sure. Speaker 3 (14:59) Yeah. I know that the suits came down about six weeks into the Burnett show and said, she's really rough. Do you think maybe we could look for another kid? And she said, she's a diamond in the rough. And we're keeping her. Speaker 2 (15:14) That's so humbling. Speaker 3 (15:15) I know. Wow. Yeah. Speaker 2 (15:19) She never told me that either. My grandmother loved your show. So I remember, you know, sometimes when somebody in your family loves something, you kind of, you pay different attention. And I really loved my grandmother. She had cool taste. So I remember watching the show and trying to understand what she loved about it. And she loved the family dynamics because she was Southern. Even I think the part of that resonated with her. Speaker 2 (15:43) The thing that really sticks out in my mind when I sort of just have a kind of emotional resonance on it is like, for lack of a better word, there was like a Speaker 1 (15:51) sisterhood between you two. Speaker 2 (15:53) You know what I mean? Like, it's obviously her show, but you're not treated or you don't feel like it's her and then you. Speaker 1 (16:00) Well, I did. Speaker 2 (16:01) No, but I'm saying. I think she was kind of Speaker 3 (16:03) on a pedestal for a lot of years. But the vibe Speaker 2 (16:04) this way is a kind of an evenness. Speaker 3 (16:07) Oh, yeah. Yeah. Speaker 2 (16:08) You know what I mean? Speaker 3 (16:09) Like a kid, like a kid sister. Speaker 2 (16:10) Yes. And I, so whether it was. Speaker 2 (16:14) brilliance or guile or all of the above or just affection she you come off in the show as part of her world that always came across yeah no matter the circumstance so that's really beautiful to me because that's that's that's something beyond just like seeing some talent in you yeah Speaker 3 (16:30) and and that's why i was hired was to play her kid sister yeah originally yeah Which is true to her story. She took her kid sister to New York. Yeah. So as Speaker 2 (16:40) the show goes on, do you feel like you gain more? Speaker 2 (16:45) not power or agency, did they ask you more of your opinion or did you always feel like I just got to kind of be cool? I Speaker 3 (16:51) don't think they ever asked for my opinion. And I was so shy. If you could get me to say hi, it was a miracle. And Speaker 2 (16:57) her husband was the producer. Executive producer. Yeah, right. So obviously it's her world too. Speaker 3 (17:04) Yeah. The first thing they let me do outside of playing her sister was a sketch we did, I think, in the second season. And it was a takeoff of the newlywed game. And I was married to one of our crazy-looking, silly little writers. And Carol was married to the guest star. And I think Harvey was married to somebody else. And it was a takeoff on that game. And this Speaker 2 (17:30) character for that sketch was really stupid. Speaker 3 (17:36) And she kind of became a staple of mine. And I think their thinking was if she screws it up, she's not going to mess up the whole sketch because it was a very tiny little part. And if she's good, it's a stepping stone. I really am pretty sure that's what they thought. Wow. Speaker 2 (17:52) And then you're with, obviously, like I said, Conway was appearing occasionally, but later he becomes a regular. And of course, that cast is the one that everybody fixates on, the four of you. If you could just talk a little bit about... their comedic gifts because like those are like ace you know improv guys their ability to improvise is even if you watch like Blazing Saddles that Harvey's on it's like there's obviously a lot of improv going on yeah and the timing and the I Speaker 3 (18:24) think well they were both brilliant in their own way Harvey was classically trained as an actor and he took his comedy very very seriously serious business And, you know, Carol had a show to run. So it was Harvey who took me under his wing. And I decided to teach me to be a comedian. Can Speaker 2 (18:46) you