A Crazy NBA Month With Zach Lowe, Plus Taylor Sheridan on Building a TV Empire and the Problems With Hollywood

The Bill Simmons Podcast

Bill Simmons discusses the NBA trade rumors surrounding Jaylen Brown, the Celtics' handling of his situation, and the dynamics between Brown and Jayson Tatum. He also explores Taylor Sheridan’s rise in television and Hollywood’s challenges.

Key takeaways

• Celtics may have mishandled Jaylen Brown's trade situation by not acting decisively.
• Brown's frustration suggests he feels undervalued despite his playoff heroics.
• Tatum's silence on Brown's trade rumors hints at underlying team tensions.

Transcript preview

This episode of the Bill Simmons podcast is presented by PayPal. You know a clutch move and you see one. A no look pass, a buzzer beater, a big steel. Well, imagine if your wallet could pull off moves like that. That, my friends, is PayPal. Right now you can find offers from hundreds of brands like Sony, all birds and Viator and save offers before you check out. Earn unlimited rewards. Plus you can add those rewards. on top of credit card points. Now that is clutch. Download the PayPal app today. Save those offers. Start scoring rewards and exclusions apply. See PayPal.com slash rewards terms credit card points subject to issuers terms and conditions. Bill Simmons, live on the second half of the pod. We have an incredible victorious day in Philadelphia where he celebrated a World Cup win with a bunch of tall Croatians. Very tall. I was worried you were getting crushed and a group hug at some bar last night, but you made it, you're here. I made it home, I may have gotten crushed, there may have been a lot of group hugs, Croatians know how to party and we move on to the round of 32. We're going to be underdogs. But that's fine. Look, I'm glad, if this is it, I got to see Luca modrich summoned great game start to finish and that was amazing. And you're 2 and 0 in the World Cup this year in person. Yeah, that's been pointed out to be my multiple people associated with the Croatian football team that I like I have to go to every game now. I might need to go to Toronto. It's being pushed on me that I might need to and I'm just putting out there. Metz play Blue Jays the day before in Toronto. I could do a double day just skip NBA free agency altogether and just go to be a sports fan. 75 minutes which includes Jaylon Brown. I have not given any take yet on the Lamello trade to Minnesota. You did a whole podcast about it. We're gonna talk Charlotte Phoenix a little bit. We're gonna talk about what happened to LeBron and we're gonna talk about craziest prediction for the week. You have podcast coming at least tomorrow and probably Wednesday, maybe two maybe three. I'm gonna have at least one more on Thursday. So that is the schedule. Jaylyn Brown, not traded yet. flying around. I don't know if he has lost trade value because teams know they want to trade him or because of his contract or whatever. I thought it would be resolved a little bit quicker. He was in France. A little pissy about some advanced metrics, tweets, got mad at Bobby Marks for passing along, something he heard from a front office. He's been doing panels. The word on the street on Jayland in France. And I know multiple people who were either in his vicinity. or whatever is that he was acting like he's done in Boston and that this is it and I don't think he's very happy with this. Do you think Boston mishandled this in any way? First of all, you have sources on the ground across France. Like whatever region, the Bordeaux region, oh it's canned, okay, so you have sources on the ground. He was on sports panels there. I don't think he's really too happy about the last couple weeks. What would the mishandling have been? Let's lead with the thing. They won the championship with Jaylon Brown and Jason. I'm just talking about this off season. So from literally final buzzer of game seven until right now, what is the case that Boston has mishand? Is it not trading him already? Is it even getting into the Yannus bidding to begin with? Because you can't not have that get out. And even it's only, and once he gets out that you're interested in Yannus, who is better than Jaylon Brown, older but better. and addresses it. Okay, okay fine, we can litigate that if you want. Once that gets out, there's no other realistic path for this to happen. Like you don't, it doesn't have to be reported anymore that the Celtics are offering jail and brown, there's no other offer, that's it, it has to be jail and brown, it's just math and so you let everyone else put the logic together. So what should they, should they, I think your only alternative is you just answered your own question. Okay, trade them right away or don't get involved with the I think the Celtics have done a great job this decade I've rarely disagreed with anything they've done. They get into this the honest thing and they make a real offer for him right and this is I think two weeks before he gets traded. They're anticipating that because of past dealings with Milwaukee and because of how the league works that this won't get out this is gonna stay between us. Well here there's a couple of different things that happen this time around. new owner we have Jimmy Haslam in there now he wasn't really in there like when the Drew holiday stuff was happening a couple years ago he wasn't in there yet you also have Milwaukee not knowing whether they wanted to keep Jayland Brown or not so obviously they're gonna be stealth canvassing his value in a couple different places and that's how this shit gets out it's the third team that always spoils this because they're delighted to tell people oh my god they checked with us and whatever so I think the mistake the Celtics made if you're gonna do this you're gonna do this put Jay Len on the table, which they did. And they only made one offer, which I've said multiple times, the offer for the Jaylen, the picks. Anything else was a lie. Hugo was never on the table. They never beeped up their offer the last weekend, nothing. But if you're going to do this, I think you just have to put Jaylin on the block at that point. Because once he's out there, you have to anticipate how he's going to react to it. This guy already feels like he's the not his. A lot of the stuff that he was saying during and after the season, even the quote about he was the most proud of the season versus any other season. I actually understand his point on that even though I don't think he should have said it that way. Everyone counted them out. Everyone over under was 41 and a half. He was the only reliable score on offensive weapon on the team. They went 56 and 23 the last 79 games. They were second and offensive raiding. you have to trade them and now that there's blood in the water and teams know they have to trade them you're gonna get chittier offers so I would have just done it all at once. So yeah I'm trying I'm trying to figure out what you think they should have done because I thought what you were gonna what you were going to say when you started what I thought you were going to say was once you put him in for Janus you then just have to make the honest trade which means swallow Shireman and gazales or whatever it is but you're not saying just think you're not but haven't they opened it up isn't that what's happening right now? They did it now but they did it now that he's upset about how the process planned out and now that teams know they have to trade him it's a little different than being like hey we're pursuing Janus with Jaylin but we're also open for offers right now and I just feel like it's a better market if teams feel like oh shit Jaylin's gonna be on the table I'm competing against the possibility that he's gonna get traded to Milwaukee Yana. Now I don't know who they're competing with it. I also feel like having actually watched the Celtic games last year and like most of the people who are online just doing analytics and on-off shit and stuff like that like as you know and I've said this many times I really value the reliability of a durable star who over and over again has to carry this burden that night after night he's got to be the best player he's got a match against the other team's best player and it's like oh the on-off was not great when he was that well the Celtics had an awesome bench right of the best assets of the team when their bench came in their bench was better than just about every other bench in the league and that's gonna skew those stats a little bit what you can't capture and go back and look at his game log going against Detroit San Antonio okay C pick one of the best teams in the league last year he was their only guy that I knew was gonna show up in the game I didn't know if Derek white I didn't paint and p pewhter it's you know as good as good as he's trick-or-treat sometimes he just doesn't have it just doesn't have it just Jaylin. So I think weirdly he's become underrated. I don't really understand it. I mean a lot of it has to do, I, my brain is just can't do the analytics thing. I can't do it, I don't want to do it. So let's just park that over here. A lot of it is just the contract, right? And I think like this is the difference between the, this ties into why the Hornets traded now when he's on his second contract and not when they've potentially signed him to sign him to the third one I don't think it would get much bigger in the mellows case but with Jaylin because he made all NBA and they won the championship and all that it's now at a point where it's like 60 65 like these are just hard deals to trade for someone who's not one of the I don't want to get into where to rank him but he's not a top five player in like a no-brainer with a bullet top 15. But he's one of the top 15. He sure is and yeah I mean he was last year I my top 15 on the last ringer 100 we did coming off last season. It's just a it's a hard trade to make and it's if you don't get Janus now you're staring at is there a deal out there that we can sell our fan base and we can sell the current players on the team that like hey wait we traded him for what like that does that not make us worse this season like oh it's cool that we cleaned up the cap sheet and got a couple picks but like what's the headliner that we got that helps us now. season in row basically a chance to contend after you've won the 24 title I I just feel like they must have known that we listen we you and I have both talked to a million people about Tatum and and J. Lynn and do they get along do they not get along is it are they good like work relationship but not friends like you could go into it a million different ways it's the people around them that always cause the problems I think for the most part I'm sure those two guys are fine together but the circles around the people are the ones that start half the shit. I do think it's notable that Jaylin didn't really say a lot about Tatum during the season. It was not about, you never heard like, I can't wait to get my brother back, there was none of that stuff. And then after the season, and especially the last three weeks, where's Tatum? Where's Tatum? He hasn't said anything this off season. Jlin said at one point, Tatum was coming on his twitch or whatever. he hasn't come on. How about the last couple weeks about the guy who could actually squash this is the alleged leader of the team, the franchise, Tatum, who could come in and say, I don't want them to trade Jay-lin. We won the title together two years ago. I can't control the front office, but I want to try to win more titles with him. Or that's my guy, nothing. It's been dead silence, which makes me think that the team has felt at some point either during the season or right after that this is a wrap, that this is a wrap and that this is a wrap and that Tatum probably wants him to have his own team and that's probably the answer right? I mean having your own team being like have we not reached a point where I guess there's just no what is the star duo this is a great question for you that has gotten the closest to being actual equal peers like not 1A 1B but like 1A 1A is it Shaq and Kobe like what's the one that that transformed from Pipp and Jordan to something because I look at these guys and I'm like why can't they both average 27 points a game like why does it like it's is that not on the table does it have to be someone's team I someone's always going to be considered better right a better all-around player whatever but in terms of whose team it is who controls the ball like I don't know when Tatum came back last year obviously he's easing into it but I didn't feel like there was any sort of oh wow things have changed so dramatically for jail in the playoffs and it just felt a little more taint thing. To answer your question, I honestly have to go back to the 60s with Elgin and Jerry I think. I think that's the last time where it's like I don't even know who's better between these two and Shaq and Kobe were there a little bit but Shaq always had that Trump card of like in a playoff series if there wasn't a team that could guard Shaq he just ran a mock I mean his three final stats were at a whole other level than Kobe and I mean. one though because I think Steph is a better guy all time than Durant but I do feel like Durant was the best guy in those two teams. Now part of it was because Steph took that took a real step back and really let Durant kind of be more of the guy on those teams but that's that's a good one though and by the way how long did those guys last together three years and I think I think that's a good parallel to this because I think the reason I'm always gonna think this and Durant no matter how many panels he goes on climate in different countries talking about the future sports and entertainment and business. I'm always gonna feel this way. I think he thought after he went ahead Ted with LeBron and beat him in the 2017 title that he was gonna get his flowers and his just-do as one of the great guys not only of this century but maybe the best guy in the league. And it didn't happen and it was like, no, you joined Steph's team, that's why he won. And I think it got to the point where he's like I can't win here, I can't win here, I have to leave. I wonder if Jaylin's at that point a little bit too where he's like I we want a title I'm finals MVP I'm conference finals MVP I carried our team last year and now the moment Tatum gets back they're like thanks Jaylin we're gonna trade you for you honest now and I think he wants to leave I don't I don't think he feels like he was respected in the right way now there's a million things you and I don't know about is there behind the scene years old, he'd his best season ever last year. He's played 2,600 minutes and 10 years, 26,000 minutes in 10 years, almost 5,000 playoff minutes. The guy's really fucking good. Like even if you're going like, you know, he's 142 playoff games, I think he's 20 a game in the playoffs. And if you're going like 125 games and up, it's a list of like 15 guys and all of them are awesome. And I just can't believe some of the trades that I think seem to think what he's worth. It's like Portland won't give up Donovan clinging. They won't? For Jaylen Brown, that's going to be a dealbreaker for you? Like, so I, is that, I've never seen anything like this and I don't know how it plays out. I think it's more likely he ends up coming back to the team. I mean someone has to play Center for the Blazers, right? I mean, someone has to play Center for the blaz. Let me make a couple of parallels and I don't think any of these are good parallels are good parallels. I don't think any of parallels are good parallels are good parallels. I don't People just today when talking about the challenge of trading a player making as much money as Jaylin Brown who's a very good player but again not a he's on the MVP ballot every year kind of player Anthony Davis was thrown out Trey Young was thrown out I rejected both those out of hand I'm like he's younger than Anthony Davis a million times more durable he's much bigger than Trey young and he's a two-way player and he's in his prime I reject them the best one I heard was who the wolves felt like we have we're like this contract is really hard to move and we're in a financial prison with the apron and all the other guys we have this is the most palatable deal we have on paper it's like really not that sexy it's Julius Randall Diamanchenzo and one first round pick it's it's gonna land like a little bit of a bomb with our fans and it could go badly and it has gone badly but they felt like they kind of had to do it's the best one they could do and I thought that was a very good parallel to this situation just in terms of where the player is or was in the hierarchy I think Jay Len's last season towns has had start to finish but just generally where there but here's the difference could towns have ever gone 56 and 26 with the two through 15 the Jay Len had last year no I don't think so and like I just think Jay one should get more credit for the season last year and I don't understand like he was 29 a game And he's just here to see him being like, I don't know if he's, how good is he? I don't know about that contract. It's like, well, he's one of the 15 best guys in the league and all of those guys have max contracts. So why wouldn't he have a max? What's he gonna be playing for 35 million a year? I get it. I get it. And it's gonna be, that's gonna be, that's why all those parallels, something changes between now and whenever, between taking an offer for Jhelan Brown that is going to be, let's say, not super well received by the fan base maybe. I'm not saying it's going to be bash or it's going to be poorly received, but it's not going to be like the Bonanza package that you would expect trading a player of this caliber. Or trying like hell to put the tooth base back in the tube and just say, hey, you know what, we're going to figure it out. You guys have played all well together for many years. That's. That's. That's. is why Missoula behind the scenes is one of the most respected beloved coaches. Like this is a guy that during the 2024 Olympics when Tatum his playing time was getting yanked around and he wasn't put like Zoula flew to France to make sure he was cool. Like this is a guy who has been attuned with those dudes the whole time. I'm sure he's talking to Jaylin all the time. And if anybody could just get those two dudes in a room and just be like, look man, let's work this out. Like we still have it, we can still be the best team, we can still be the best team in the best team in the best team in the best team in the best team in the the problem is I don't know if Jaylin has just reached a point in no return because the difference here is that they've won the title so it can't be one of those things like I don't have a ring yet he's out here he already has the ring he already has the respect from last year now he wants the respect from the team in the city and I think deep down he probably knows like that's gonna be always gonna be Tatum's town and not mine that's just the way it is. Can I throw a what if at you? yeah but they lose to New York anyway in the second round the year that he got hurt and like how does the next calendar year play out because like it's still quote-unquote Tatum's team more than Jaylin's team but it's they're both still healthy and play like I just would be interested to see how that plays out because Tatum's injury is what has changed this dynamic I mean that's obvious but I just don't like do we end up in this same place anyway or or or not I don't know the answer to that. Well, if we were one of Jaylon Brown's every every ABA star has funkeys around them, right? He was just like, you're great, let's go to dinner. Oh, the checks here you better pay. If we were two of Jaylon Brown's frunkies, wouldn't we be like, why are you the one being traded? Why wouldn't Tatum be traded? It's coming up a major injury. His contract's as big, like you're just planning that stuff in his head constantly, right? I mean, right? I mean, right? I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. I would. Why would. Why would. Why would. Why would. Why would. Why would. Why would. Why would. Why would Why just you? I would like I feel like I would be a more valuable member of a friend group of a friend group than that I would be a more reasonable member of the friend group but I did this this is why this is why I asked you devil's advocate two weeks ago or last week whenever we said this I said if I'm jail and brown I'm looking around being like why is it just assumed that if we have to break up I'm the one that goes like this guy just is coming off an Achilles injury now I say that I think that I think Jason tatum is a I think that's largely that's been proven out so I get why if the Celtics are making a choice it is Tatum but if I also get Jhelan Brown being like what else do I have to do like what else do you need me to do to be of worth of he's there he's there right now he's like we you guys were gonna tank last season we were building our way to top three seed and you traded diamonds for the corpse of Vusavich to save more money and then you threw J. T. too many minutes and he couldn't even play in game seven. Like, there's no blood on my hands for anything that happened last season. Here, when you talked about what trade would the Celtics fan base accept, an example of one they wouldn't, if it was Zach Levine's expiring in a boatload of King's picks. Like three first, two swaps, whatever, that's not flying. Same for Brooklyn, if it was Porter's expiring and a bunch of Brooklyn pick swaps, that's not flying either. New Orleans, which I think maybe you would have said a month ago, Murphy with Zion, and maybe even a pick, I think that prices drop now and I think pool has to be in it as an expiring. I think that's Murphy and Pool and maybe two firsts. And I don't even know if New Orleans says yes to that. Because New Orleans is like, well, what are we going to do? We're not going to win the title with Jaylin. You don't think New Orleans would say yes to Trey Murphy, Jordan Poofee Jordan Pool, who is just. money plus two picks and two unprotected picks which seems like a pretty fair trade no one in the league seems to know if New Orleans is like open for business if they're just like if they're out if they're out if they're out for the holiday weekend already like with anyone there well here's the Portland trade too so these last three are the ones that I was centered on that New Orleans one for Portland I think Drew has to be in the trade I don't want Jeremy Grant It's the same contract to Drew Holiday. It's the exact same contract, basically. I'd much rather have Drew Holiday, who's already been in Boston. I don't disagree with you, but I don't, I think Jeremy Grant's availability has been an issue. He actually shot it pretty well last year. I don't, I don't think he's just sort of like dead money by any means. Well, how about this? Drew Holiday and Pick's for Pick's, I don't, how many guards. I don't know. How many picks is Kamara worth at least two but that half but that's the kind of trade where you are going to be met with the talk radio or whatever backlash of like we just traded a finals MVP for who's the headliner the 36 37 year old guard who we already had on the team once and he's fine he's good and like to money who like the money what the Boston the Boston casual fans to have no idea who that is and like like I don't think you're off base pitching that is like the structure of a trade that makes some sense for both teams though I don't know if Portland loves the obdia jail and brown fit personally but it would be I'll tell you this it would be a bitch to play against a lot of downhill force whoa this is this whoa this is a billowing around Denver in general. Some I believe, some I don't believe. Murray and Cam Johnson for Jay Lynn and Houser, which would save Denver $10 million this year, the Celtics could take Cam Johnson in their trade exception. Murray is $50 million this year, $54 and $57. So he's about $8 million behind Jaylin in each of those years. But same amount of years. seven, eight million. I'm adding Kim Johnson, who I can either keep or spin in a trade. And I am getting somebody who I still think is one of the best 25 players in the league back for Jaylin. And I think I'm on Boston, I'm signing up for that trade. From Denver, I'm at least having a six hour meeting and it's a reconstruction of a team because you're gonna remove the Murray Oakage pick and roll, but you could run a lot of that offense through a Joker. You re-signed Payton Watson with the extra money. You have him more involved offensively and you could argue that that team's better, it's bigger, it's deeper. You have yokeage and Gordon and Jaylon as your front line. You're just, you have more flexibility and you have somebody who can really step in if Gordon gets hurt, which he gets hurt every year and now you're not getting destroyed if that happens and you're under the tax and you can get Watson. That trade makes a ton of sense to me, that. It's a very it's a good trade. It's a well well done Picasso trade. Boston gets a little smaller. I think it depending on whether cam Johnson you know sticks around the team they get a little saw although they played with only one of the Jays almost all of last year anyway. It's a good trade they I mean Jamal Murray addresses a need for Boston. something they could only really do last year when Simons was on the team and then couldn't. And also like the reason they got into this Janus thing in general was because they felt like Hugo and Shireman and maybe even Houser Walsh like they just felt like they could patch the minutes together that Jaylin had with worse stats but at least like two-way stuff and then Tatum would take some of the offensive slack but really they wanted to unleash ago which is why he was untouchable in that trade. So they would cover the wings, they would But it's an interesting team and honestly I think Murray's a great bet I thought he had too much of a burden on the nuggets It was basically him or yolkage doing everything and he's in the West and I I thought he was really good last year and I thought he wore down as as March April We got into the playoffs Celts could put him on a 30 minute game timeline with white and Pritchard and I just feel like they could manage his minutes better Here's my obstacle if I'm Denver Christian Brown is now my only proven rotation playoff level guard on the whole team out of anyone now I can do maybe bring Bruce Brown on the minimum whatever it sounds like Tim Hardaway Jr is gonna have some suitors and maybe out of their price range jail and picket is the only point guard on the team like the only one and that makes me a little bit nervous they have their mid-level on this though or at least like some preage and stuff it's pretty tight but I have to sit and I have to sit and redo the math and I have to do the They could because they're shaving some money off there. I mean they'd get guys I also think there'd be a learning curve of like fitting jail and brown's game with the yoke point you're going all in on point yokech like almost all in depending on you getting free agency and sort of fitting jail and brown into that universe I think would be have a little sticky at time kind of went in all in on that anyway didn't they? Well the Murray yokech pick and roll and like Murray is like a fail safe like all right tonight's tonight's just cooking you can't you can't you can't you can't you can run that you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't Brown. It just feels a little different than me to me then and that's maybe that's fine and you obviously get bigger and there's something's kind of fun about like yolkich in a bunch of wings and like tweener forwards just taking up the entire court with their arms. Right a little more flexibility that that was my favorite fake one of all those who do you think has a longer meeting about that trade so it's just Murray and Kim Johnson for Jay Len and Houser that's it. Who has a longer meeting about it? has the longer meeting because they are they are at some sort of crossroads where they need to figure out we're really good we fell short we had a lot of health issues Aaron Gordon again you know the two teams that were above us and the standings are just so goddamn good that we have this all-time great player in the middle of this prime has what we do growing stale is it is it is it time to make change almost for change is at times it just sort of risk a little bit of like instability in the way we play just to get our upside up a little bit and where is that is that too risky I don't know but I think they are at a major crossroads as a franchise I also have to bring back Payton Watson by the way which we have we didn't bring up but I think that's that's part of that trade right that saving 10 million makes it way easy to bring it back I mean just imagine a lineup of Christian Brown and Yoko Sha answers every question on offense that has ever been posed to him, but that's a pretty funky lineup and that would be like five would pay a lot of money to watch that watch them work that out. Well basically you'd be getting weird which is we're gonna talk about Minnesota after the break but it's the same kind of principle to me if I'm them I don't think the team I have I can beat O'KC in San Antonio and they're fucking pit bull guards on both teams and I don't think I don't think I can get Jamal Murray through two straight rounds of that, plus Minnesota maybe two with McDaniel's and Edwards. Like, I just, you could see him wearing down in real time, I thought last year, so that would be the reason. But that would be a weird one for me, because obviously, Yokoj and Curry are my two favorite non-Seltics and to have Jaylin on a Yolkage team. And I, you know, I'm about as pro-J-Lin as you're going to find. I'm, he really, I thought he was just awesome last I love the fact that the best quality about him and this is what advanced analytics isn't going to measure is he really is up for the challenge if somebody else is a good team with a really good player he takes it personally and wants to outplay that person in a game and I it sounds like a really dumb thing to say but there's just not enough guys in the league that are wired like that you know where it's like oh this guy I've circled this game I've been dying to go against this team tonight so anyway all right We're going to take a break and then I'm going to unleash my Lamello trade opinions. I can't wait. The Bill Simmons podcast is brought to you by Fandool, Fandel making the USA's run even more exciting. And it's threatening to become a run, by the way. Every match, every goal, every step toward the knockout stage, there is more on the line than ever before. 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It's giving you a chance to win $1 million worth of tickets and prizes. worth playing for Enter now at Miklob Ultra.com slash Superior Access slash FIFA World Cup 26. headlines prizes and details. One last point I wanted to make in that Jayland trade. We didn't have a Houston trade in there because Houston has literally been telling everybody we want no part of Jaylin, we're not interested. That team was a Bravo show last year. How were they drawing how were they drawing the light at Oh Jaylin Brown would make us weird you guys had the weirdest team in the planet. You know what Jaylin Brown would do is actually show up for games and not rollover in a playoff series. Anyway. Yeah, it's just like settled down. What's the number one. You guys were a disaster last year. Educate me. What's the number one Bravo show in your life? What's a Bravo show that you watch? Real Housewives. Real housewives. So all the real housewives of any variety. That's all Bravo. Everyone. They're just still spinning off cities. They did Rhode Island. That's a, if you go to rich Newport, Rhode Island, there's probably some good stuff going on there. Some good accents, too. My wife's a big below deck fan. Lamello trade. You already gave your take? I did. Do I'm going to give the cliff notes of your take or do you want to just give your 45 second take? No, I want to hear the Bill Simmons cliff. Let's filter it through your years. I listened to your pod. I listened to a nice little power walk, a very hot LA. And you were bullish on the trade for both teams actually. I think it's like a B for both teams. If I were a trade grade guy, that's about what I would do. for Charlotte and I'll go into the reasons in a second. I couldn't believe the trade from Minnesota. I fucking hated it. I hated it. I just couldn't believe it. You do this trade, I wrote down some notes. You do this trade if you want to become the most beloved NBA team with under 25 fans who play video games and are online a lot. It's a 2K merchandise jersey selling trade. I get it. You don't. You don't want teams to double, Anthony Edwards anymore. I feel like I get it is kind of an important qualifier too. I hate the fucking trade. I get it on paper. Lamello ball would solve a lot of problems that you had in the Anthony Edwards last year. There's one problem. He doesn't fucking play. He's played two seasons of the last six. Last year Charlotte brilliantly, only he played big minutes early, got hurt. He came back. I watched a ton of Charlotte last year. He's played big minutes early, got hurt. They were using him like a race car on Sundays just driving him slowly around the block He averaged 27.5 minutes a game from mid November on Zach They were really really careful about not getting him hurt again almost like they knew they were gonna trade him this summer flawed mid-20 superstar What does that mean? Well just that's how you that's how you're able to get a guy like this for Nas Reed? And I get it from the Minnesota side where on paper makes sense now that could play Lamello and aunt and Io together against these smaller lineups against San Antonio and against O'KC which didn't have the option to do last year and that the only thing I really understand from it is that they built they built that previous team to beat Denver right? Connolly is like we have to beat Denver. What is the team we can put together to beat Denver and now it seems like they built this new team to beat O'C and San Antonio who are who are who are who are going to beat them. Well, how do you beat them? These two three-point shooters and we can guard with I. O' and McDaniels and Go Bear, hopefully protecting Lamello. And we're going to have three-point shooting variants with these two guys who in any game can get super hot. I just don't trust Lamello at all. And if you're wrong, Ant's leaving. And by the way, Tim Conley, I'm cool making this trade. And if it doesn't work out, I'm seeing you guys anyway, I'm seeing you guys anyway, I'm going to be out. I'm going to be out. I'm going to be out. I'm going to be out. I'm going to be out. It's got a year left on his deal. So this to me feels like a hail-mary trade that your fans are going to like because Lam-Mello is the best player in it. The Charlotte fans are mad because they love Lamello. Lamello doesn't fucking play. I wrote down, he's the least herbal good guard of the last 25 years. Six seasons, 9400 minutes, zero playoff games, which puts him on this crazy list of guys who have averaged 20 points a game in their first six seasons, but have played less than 10, 10,000 minutes. it's basically just him and John Moran and Zion and that's it. He's not reliable. He has a, I think he has metal in his ankle. Like this is not like, oh, Steph Curry had ankle injuries too. The Melzinger's injuries are way worse than Steph Curry's were and I just wouldn't have bet on it. I thought this was a crazy trade. Okay, I mean, that's it. That's why I've landed it right away. percent fair game. Also, something I probably should have mentioned more when I reacted the other day was there is this sort of like drip drip trickle down effect of Minnesota transactions kind of chasing their own tail a little bit similar to how Dallas had to chase its own tail when like all right we left Jill and we let Jill and Bruntz ago we got to trade for Kyrie. The Grant Williams thing blew up on our face we got to trade him and a pick to replace him with people there's like a little element of that for Go Bear, we're a little asset poor. Now we're really expensive. We're probably gonna have to trade towns. We trade towns, okay, that didn't really work. Now we have to do something else. So there's a little bit of element of like chasing their tail a bit. I get all of the concerns. I guess my guess my, if you're worried about Anthony Edwards happiness level, I guess my question would be what