The One-Skill-a-Year Plan for a More Interesting Life

The Art of Manliness

Ravi Gupta introduces the concept of the 'Invisible List,' a collection of abandoned or deferred desires that can be tackled through a struc

Key takeaways

• The 'Invisible List' differs from bucket lists by focusing on long-term skill acquisition rather than one-off experiences.
• Aiming for an intermediate level is a realistic and sustainable goal within a single calendar year.

Main topics

• The Invisible List concept
• Bucket lists vs. Skill lists

Notable quotes

It's not because I couldn't do it. It's was because I wasn't dedicated enough and organized enough.

Conclusion

The episode provides a practical framework for lifelong learning, enco

Transcript preview

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It's worked for us for years, and I reckon it will work for you. If you're ready to hear the... of your first sale, head over to shopify.com slash manliness to start your free trial today. That's right. Start your free trial at shopify.com slash manliness. That's shopify.com slash manliness. Brett McKay here, and welcome to another edition of the AOM Podcast, which since 2008 has featured conversations with the world's best authors, thinkers, and leaders that glean their edifying, life-improving insights without the fluff and filler. The AOM Podcast is just one part of the McKay mission to help individuals practice timeless virtues through thought, word, and deed. Also, be sure to explore our articles on artofmanliness.com, read the deeper dives we do in our sub-stack newsletter at dyingbreed.net, and turn our content into real-world action by joining the Strenuous Life program at strenuouslife.com. Now on to the show. We all have things we've always wanted to know how to do, but have never gotten around to learning. Speak a foreign language, play an instrument, write a book, take up surfing. Maybe you've even started one of these pursuits a few times, only to drop it after a couple of weeks. My guest calls this collection of abandoned or deferred desires, your Invisible List, and is the author of a book of the same name. Today on the show, Ravi Gupta presents a plan for tackling the things in your Invisible List by picking one hobby-like activity each year and working your way to an intermediate level in it. He explains the different categories these pursuits can fall into, from the liftoff project to the mental marathon to the skill radical, and how to pick the right one for your season of life. We also discuss how camps for grownups can make skill acquisition more enjoyable, why you should consider taking up an adult-appropriate sport like tennis, why Ravi decided to take the MCAT even though he doesn't plan to become a doctor, and how working on your Invisible List can give your life chapters and, over a course of a decade, turn you into a renaissance man badass. After the show's over, check out our show notes at awim.is slash invisiblist. Speaker 4 (2:45) All right. Ravi Gupta, welcome to the show. Excited to be here. So you got a new book out called The Invisible List. We're going to talk about what The Invisible List is today. But you start the book off with how you were going to friends' weddings. You were getting married. And there was one wedding you went to in particular that you realized, I've got this invisible list, which is like stuff I've wanted to do my entire life, passions, hobbies, but I never got around to doing. Why did these weddings... gets you thinking about that? Speaker 2 (3:15) Well, you know, at the time I was running a network of schools down South and I was 24 seven for my students, my teachers and families. And, you know, it's such a cliche to say and to open a self-help book to be like, I was burnt out, but there's no other way to open it because it was true. And I was gaining weight. You know, I'm 43 now. I look back to then when I was in my late twenties and early thirties and I look older then. than I do now. But like anything else, you're not completely aware of what's going on with you. And the interesting thing about a wedding is it's an opportunity to check in with people who haven't seen you in a while. And they notice right away. And I was going to these weddings and I was hearing all kinds of things, including my buddy, Sam, who was like, hey, are you on drugs? And I wasn't on drugs. I was just completely hopelessly spent and not taking care of myself. And that was kind of the genesis of a lot of changes I needed to make in my life. Speaker 4 (4:15) I think one thing you talk about is you wanted to dance because there's dancing at weddings. You're like, I've been wanting to take salsa dancing, but I never got around to it. Like that's, that's one of those things on my list of things I've wanted to do, but I'd never made time for. Speaker 2 (4:28) Well, that, you know, that is a big impetus behind this book in general. Right. So at the wedding, I see people salsa dancing and doing other kinds of dancing. I'm like, you know what? I've picked up and put down salsa dancing so many times. Speaker 2 (4:41) I never followed through, you know, and it went all the way through that wedding to other weddings, you know, like there were a couple of weddings a couple of years later where I just kept having this experience, right? Where I would just be like, I tried. I didn't follow through. It's not because I couldn't do it. It's because I wasn't dedicated enough and organized enough. And there are a bunch of things like that. You hear somebody speaking a language you want to speak or there's a screenplay that's like a little similar to what you wanted to write. And these things accumulate in your head and they bother you. I imagine a lot of people listening to this have all kinds of examples of this. And it eats away at you and your confidence. And if you don't start to pull those things off the list and nurture them, you can grow into a very cranky, regret-filled person. And my whole book is about how to be the opposite, right? To be somebody who feels like there are endless possibilities even as you get older. And that's really the journey I started right around then. Speaker 4 (5:34) So what other things were on your invisible list? So you had salsa dancing. What else was on there? Speaker 2 (5:39) You know, it's hard to go back and remember everything that was on there, but certainly all kinds of writing. So I had been picking up and putting down a memoir of some sorts to write about my experiences growing up in Staten Island and then working in politics and in schools. And I would start it. I would stop it. I didn't have confidence to write. I had all kinds of writer's block. I would tell myself that it was indulgent to do that. Surfing was certainly on the list. I'm sure we'll get to that. Break dancing was on the list, something I did as a kid and then stopped, which I, for many reasons, have still not pulled off my list. And languages of all kinds have been on the list. And so, you know, there are a ton of different things, flying airplanes, some things that I have never gotten to even till this day. And my list was growing and growing and growing. And I just kept telling myself, you know what, like, that's not me. I'm a responsible adult now. And, you know, that's for dilettantes and rich people and Tom Cruise. That's for people who have endless time and money. Speaker 4 (6:39) Yeah, I've got my list of things. One of them that I've started and stopped multiple times is drawing, like pencil sketching. That's one. Another one is language. Like I used to speak Spanish fluently. but I haven't done it in over 20 years. And I'm always thinking, I should probably get back to speaking Spanish again. And then I make these sort of attempts, but then I abort mission a couple of weeks later. What else has been on my list? Oh, piano. That's another one. So I took a piano class in college. I enjoyed it. And I was a decent beginner for a semester of piano in college. And I've always like, I should get back into doing that. And I've picked up some beginner piano handbooks and I'll do it for a week. And then, yeah, no. stop. Speaker 2 (7:21) Yep. And you know, those are actually very common. What you just named piano and languages are very common. And I think what's fascinating about those two is that those are two things that people are forced to do as kids usually, and they don't enjoy them. And you'd often, unless you're, you have a tiger parent, you don't follow through on them. And for me, languages has been that too. Like I picked up and put down Italian. so many times. And I really, really want to be fluent one day. And I know that that will be a hallmark of one of my years. Speaker 4 (7:51) How is an invisible list different from a bucket list? Speaker 2 (7:54) Bucket list to me is like, I want to go to Paris. I want to see the Eiffel Tower. I want to, you know, I want to see the Northern Lights in. Iceland or whatever, right? So it can include things, and this is also somewhat true of the Misogi concept in Japan, is like things that are almost one-off things that you could cross off just by like a short sprint period of time, like either just going to the right place, going to the right restaurant. You know, when people talk about bucket lists, for example, in New York City, it's like, you know, go to Central Park during the day and read a book or something like that, right? It's not this ongoing investment, usually, the way people talk about bucket lists. Speaker 4 (8:29) Whereas Speaker 2 (8:29) the invisible list, it's really... about tackling things that are hard and that require a year to become at least intermediate at. And the whole process is all about creating themes to your years to say, okay, this is not just about one thing you did that year, but about a process you went through the entire year and a skill. or hobby that you've acquired that year that you can either take with you into future years or say, hey, I am glad I did that thing, but I'm never going to do it again. But it really is a whole different level of commitment than what people typically talk about when they talk about bucket lists. Speaker 4 (9:10) Okay. So an invisible list, it's more skill focused, hobby focused, and these are hobbies that require commitment. And then, like you said, the way you approach your invisible list is you're laying out a process. that you have to commit at least a year towards. So I think when most people, like I'm a perfect example of that, when I'm like, I want to learn this new skill, I like the idea of it. And then I'll kind of take sort of half steps towards it. And then I give up after maybe two or three weeks. You're saying, no, you have to give yourself a year to do this thing. Speaker 2 (9:43) Yeah. There's something powerful about a year for a few reasons. One is it's long enough that you can go from beginner to intermediate in almost anything. And two is it also allows for a little bit of trial and error. Every year, pretty much, I have this middle period of time in which I hit a slump of some form, whether it's an injury or writer's block or lack of confidence or... Just this middle period of learning where you've gotten through all the easy wins and now each new sub skill within your area takes a lot longer to learn. So a year is a good period of time for that. But the year also has a couple of other benefits. And I think the most important is it gives you chapters to your life. And you don't have to do calendar years. Some people will start theirs in September alongside their kids going to school, for example, or they'll start on their birthdays. It really doesn't matter which date you pick. I happen to pick January 1st. So I'm able to say, oh. 2020 was the year I learned to surf. 2021 was the year of tennis. And you think about all the people you met, the places you went. And so you have these themes to your years. And that combats this sort of lack of definition that tends to come as you get older, right? Because when you're a kid, you're like, oh, third grade, that was Mrs. Williamson. And I was in this building and I had these friends and I read these books, right? You could remember it to this day, most people, right? But if you think about, oh, when I was 26, what's the difference between 26 and 27 or 32 and 33? And the older you get, the less definite. issue you have. And that's demoralizing. And it's also demoralizing looking ahead because I'm 43 and I'm looking ahead. I'm like, oh my God, I'm going to be 50 one day. And you could be scared. You know, like it's coming quickly. And sooner or later, I'll be closer to 50 than I will be to 40. And you could either be scared of that, or you could reframe it and say, you know what? I've got seven more years till I hit 50. And by the time I get to 50, I will be a badass. I'll be flying airplanes. I'll speak Italian. I'll have made a movie, whatever your crazy ideas are, right? And you can picture all those things that you will do each of those years. And it actually makes you excited about the prospect of getting older instead of dreading it. Speaker 4 (11:46) I love that idea that devoting a year creates chapters in your life. Because you're right. If I look back at my life, I can see chapters in my life through my childhood, high school years, and then it ends at law school. And then after that, it's been kind of the same. Yeah, I've had kids and like there's chapters to that. But once they hit, I don't know, eight or nine or 10, they're kind of, they're pretty self-sufficient and you start losing that. And my work, you know, there's been different phases and projects that have added texture to my memory. But a lot of it's been years of the same thing, just doing the same thing over and over again. Speaker 2 (12:18) Yeah. And with your kids, I think it's interesting. I hear from people who have kids and then they're married. And, you know, the often thing I hear from people is, you know, I have to be about them. I have to be about my kids. I have to be on my way. I don't have time to be indulgent and learn pottery or whatever, you know. And I can only share my experience, which is, you know, my dad left when I was a kid. But before he left, every now and then he'd show up to my games, my football games and stuff. Now, it was cool to see him there from time to time. But looking back, my dad was very unfulfilled in certain ways. And that's... part of the reason why he left. And if I could go back in time, I'd be like, it's okay if you don't come to my game, if you're doing something that makes you excited and happy, because that's what it means to be a great dad. When I see you fulfilled and happy and actually learning things and trying hard things, that's inspiring to me. But also you're happy. So when we see each other, you're a different kind of person. And I feel like that for so many parents I see and so many spouses, it's like, It is okay. Obviously, you know, there are plenty of things you have to do and you want to do, but there's also a real value in showing your kids that you're learning new things, that you're taking risks, like that will inspire them. And often you could pick things that enrich them and your spouse, right? Like for instance, you could learn to cook, you know, extravagant meals and cook them for your family. for example. And also for your spouse, like your wife or your husband, they'll think you're sexy when you're taking on these new things. It gives you this sort of glow that will make you a more captivating person for the people around you. So I do think making room for this actually helps people around you as well. Speaker 4 (13:56) Yeah. That point about it makes you attractive to your spouse. I mean, you think about that, your wife married you because you probably had some sort of ambition when you were in your... 20s of things you were going to do. That was attractive. And then you hit 30 and 40 and you've kind of settled. And there's a virtue to having a routine and kind of being established. But seeing a person do new and exciting things, that's also incredibly attractive still, even if you're 40 or 50 years old. Speaker 2 (14:23) And you could do it within the structure of routine. So like, you know, strong couples communicate well. So a lot of people I coach through this, they'll be like, and sometimes I have both couples who are going through this process. And I'm like, okay, like somebody is a night person, somebody is a morning person. So the morning person, you know, if you're writing your novel, you'll get that time in the morning while your spouse is making breakfast and getting the kids ready for school. And then you flip it at night, you know, and there's all kinds of things like that that you could do, or you could do