Episode 140: Lost boys & The Lost Boys

Pop Culture Parenting

In this episode, Dr. Billy Garvey and Nick use the 198/87 film 'The Lost Boys' as a lens to examine the impact of rigid masculinity on boys

Key takeaways

• Around 60% of teenagers believe society expects boys to always be manly, confident, and strong.
• Research indicates that 7 in 10 young men want to take action against disrespect towards women but are often worried about backlash.

Main topics

• The dangers of rigid masculinity
• Analyzing 'The Lost Boys' film themes

Notable quotes

Masculinity itself isn't the problem but rigidity is.

Conclusion

The episode highlights that breaking down rigid masculine stereotypes

Transcript preview

Speaker 3 (0:00) Before we get into today's episode, I want to tell you about today's sponsor, and this one means a lot to me. This episode is proudly supported by Our Watch, who Speaker 2 (0:08) are leading Australia in preventing violence against women and children before it all starts. One of the ways they do that is Through the Line, a digital platform for young people aged 14 to 21 that focuses on supporting young men to have healthy and respectful relationships and showing there is no one way to be a man. Speaker 3 (0:30) And it could not line up more with what we're talking about today, because this whole episode is about healthy masculinities and what it actually takes to raise boys who feel free to be who they are. The research here is honestly staggering. Around six in ten teenagers believe society expects boys to always be manly, confident and strong. So there is this massive pressure to fit in a box, and that's something we can work to support our kids on and change. Speaker 2 (0:58) Yeah, it's really interesting, Billy, and you can sort of feel it a bit, can't you? Even the way the boys sort of chat to each other and your experience? Speaker 3 (1:04) Yeah, you really can. And the pressure has real consequences too. The research shows boys and men who hold onto rigid ideas about masculinity are far more likely to support violence and more likely to struggle with their own mental health, which is exactly why the conversation matters so much. Talking to your son. or the boys you connect with in school or clinical settings about stereotypes, about respect, about the pressure to be tough or stoic instead of just being themselves. Speaker 2 (1:30) So, like, where does a parent Speaker 3 (1:32) even start with this stuff, Billy? The good news is that most young men actually want to be part of the solution here. Recent research found out 7 in 10 young men want to take action on disrespect towards women. They're just not always sure how, or they're worried about backlash. So it's an opportunity to stay really curious. Ask your kids what they're seeing online and how it makes them feel. Listen deeply and keep the door open. The other thing you can do is direct young people in your life to The Line. It's strengths-based content made for young people to support them to have conversations and build the skills to have respectful relationships. But it's not for parents. Speaker 2 (2:12) A huge thank you to Our Watch and The Line for partnering with us to support you and for the work they do every day to build a safer Australia. for women, for kids and for the next generation of men too. Go check them Speaker 3 (2:25) out, learn more about what they do and keep having these conversations at home. They matter Speaker 2 (2:29) more than you know. Well, Dr. Billy Garvey, that is a wrap on episode 140, Lost Boys, about lost boys. Speaker 3 (2:40) Yes, a beautiful movie entitled Topic Tie. But yeah, a bit of a tough one, a bit of an uncomfortable, awkward conversation, which is kind of the point, that there's so many lost boys out there that become men that deserve brighter futures, healthier relationships. It impacts their mental health, but also the physical safety and mental health of all those around them, including children and women. Speaker 2 (3:06) Yeah, I really liked it. I learned a lot. It challenged me talking about it, like trying to get my head and switch my sort of brain into it. And it was amazing. And just thinking about how do we get those boys back? Like that was the other thing I thought about a lot. Like these boys are lost. Speaker 3 (3:21) So they're not Speaker 2 (3:21) lost anymore. Yeah, we want to help these boys that are really struggling. And I thought that that was a really nice way. Did a great job of tying it together. Thanks, Dr. Nick. My pleasure. Enjoy the episode, team, and we'll be back in another fortnight. Speaker 3 (3:36) I'm Billy, a developmental pediatrician, and I'm Nick, a developing parent. We're going to use scenes from iconic movies to talk about how we best support our kids. This is Pop Culture Parenting. I'll Speaker 1 (3:54) have your ironing brush. You'll take it out on me. Best judgment. Long Speaker 2 (4:37) awaited, Billy. We've been teasing people with the Lost Boys for a long time. Speaker 2 (4:46) We thought it was time. And so we've done it. Speaker 3 (4:51) Amazing. I reckon maybe in the first, like, definitely the first year I talked about this movie. Yeah. Speaker 2 (5:00) We've talked about it a long, long time. I mean, this Speaker 3 (5:01) is Speaker 2 (5:01) maybe my top Speaker 3 (5:02) ten. It's not for you, is it? Speaker 2 (5:04) Really? Top ten movies? Yeah. This film is in your top ten favourite movies? Yeah. Okay. I can't wait to unpack that in a minute. Speaker 3 (5:13) Michael. Speaker 2 (5:14) Michael. Michael. Speaker 3 (5:18) Maggots, Michael. You're eating maggots. Speaker 2 (5:22) If anyone hasn't seen The Lost Boys, not too late to go and watch it before you listen to the episode. No, spoilers. Spoilers. Spoilers from a film from 39 years ago. 39 years. Oh, Speaker 3 (5:33) wow. Yeah. Older Speaker 2 (5:34) than us. Yeah. Speaker 2 (5:37) When we started. When I started. You were a teenager when you saw it Speaker 3 (5:40) in cinema. Yeah, how are you going, mate? Good, you? Good, good. How are these jumpers? I know, amazing. Speaker 2 (5:48) They are amazing. For those who aren't listening, you could probably still hear them. They're that loud. They're pretty loud. You can hear the jumper through Speaker 3 (5:58) the microphone. Speaker 2 (5:59) This Speaker 3 (6:00) is a gift. Speaker 2 (6:01) I know. From the amazing Perth community. I was there. Speaker 3 (6:03) You Speaker 2 (6:04) were. This is because we have just done our Perth show. Tour. Tour wrapped. Tour wrapped. There is talk. Done. No. Speaker 3 (6:11) That Speaker 2 (6:12) is damn good. No, Speaker 3 (6:14) I Speaker 2 (6:14) don't think so. Solo tour, I reckon, mate. Speaker 3 (6:18) I could act both. I could do. You can act. Speaker 3 (6:25) I could be you too. Could you? I'm good, Speaker 2 (6:28) thanks, Billy. What was with your deep voice? Billy's referencing the fact that we have just completed our national tour, seven shows, six cities over six months. Sold out every capital. Sold out every capital, that's right. And what was the best show, Dr Nick? Speaker 2 (6:49) Oh, that's putting me on the spot. Can I say my favourite show? Oh, yes. Adelaide was my favourite show. Oh, yeah? Yep. Speaker 3 (6:56) You thought I was really in the zone? Speaker 2 (6:59) Yeah. No. I thought Adelaide was my favourite. It was the first time we'd been to a city outside of Victoria. Speaker 3 (7:05) Yeah, that's true. So I was like, Speaker 2 (7:07) this is exciting. I feel like I really, really made it. Speaker 3 (7:09) Cool little, yeah, pub with a band room. Yep. And Speaker 2 (7:14) you Speaker 3 (7:14) remember the... Rock. Rock. Rock, I loved that. I Speaker 2 (7:17) remember. Rock was cool. Speaker 3 (7:20) We can tell the rock story, can't we? Yeah, go for it. That is like, I was like, how long have you worked here? And he's like, oh, Speaker 2 (7:25) seven years. I was like, oh, awesome. Must be a cool place to work. And he goes, yeah, yeah. It's really cool because Speaker 3 (7:29) I get to meet like, you know, musicians and rock stars and stuff. And so, yeah, tonight will be pretty different. Speaker 2 (7:37) Billy was offering autographs at that stage in rock. Quarter past four on a Saturday, Avon, and death's a Speaker 3 (7:42) winner. Speaker 3 (7:44) But it was amazing. One of the greatest privileges of our lives. Best. Speaker 2 (7:47) Like Speaker 3 (7:47) this podcast. We don't get to connect with them on that level in that personal space. Totally. So really beautiful. And yeah, Perth was just amazing. Speaker 2 (7:55) Yeah. So I agree. The energy of Perth was the biggest energy. Yeah. Ben Knight, an amazing human. And Cal. Speaker 3 (8:01) And Cal. What a beautiful human. Cal's amazing because Cal listens to the pod and he's 26. 26. Doesn't have kids. He doesn't work with kids and he's... reached out and says, I want to help you guys out. And so he toured with us for free as Ben Knight did and amazing. And Ben Knight came backstage after the first night of Perth and was like, that is a warm audience. Speaker 2 (8:23) That audience was wild night one. Speaker 3 (8:27) Yeah. So lots of fun, but it was amazing. But the reason I've asked us to wear these tonight, today, sorry, is that... Lots of people gave us beautiful gifts. Beautiful gifts. And I never want to say it on a podcast when future cities are coming, like we were fishing for gifts. But yeah, it's an amazing thing. Beautiful letters, beautiful kids' books. Speaker 2 (8:46) Beanie cards, Speaker 3 (8:46) yeah, for the kids. Speaker 2 (8:47) Gifts for the kids and the missus. Yeah, made things for us. Yeah, made Speaker 3 (8:50) stuff for us. Collected books, beautiful letters. Like, yeah, and it all means a hell of a lot. Yeah, we even got a Billy, a Hunnic and Billy pot. Yes, we did. Speaker 2 (9:00) There was all Speaker 3 (9:01) sorts of stuff. Speaker 2 (9:01) Yeah. No, so it was a real privilege. It was an amazing six months doing it. And yeah, maybe again in the future. Speaker 3 (9:10) It's funny, isn't it? Because it just destroys you, whereas I feed off it. It destroys Speaker 2 (9:14) me. Emotionally. Speaker 3 (9:15) Yeah. I always Speaker 2 (9:16) feel rude. People are like, what's Speaker 3 (9:17) it Speaker 2 (9:17) like? I'm like, it's really emotionally draining as I'm meeting them. And I'm like, I just find this so much. Speaker 3 (9:22) Yeah. But I do love it. It's funny. I Speaker 2 (9:25) don't act my chops off. Speaker 3 (9:27) You do. You do. You are quite the talent. This is the funny thing. If you think we're big now, two million people have listened to this pod, imagine if we could harness you in the media. You're just too humble, mate. You're just too humble. Not as this jumper, I'm not. Your star could shine even brighter. But yes, so that was amazing. And then, yeah, should we get into some groozies and Winslays? Yeah, let's Speaker 1 (9:54) do it. Hey. Don't let your mother smell that beer on your breath. She'll take it out on me. Speaker 3 (9:59) You go, amigo. So for people who haven't listened before, Clark W. Griswold is the dad of the National Lampoons, and this is an example of something that I think is really important to see in social media, especially off a developmental pediatrician, where we haven't done so well with our kids. And it's important to show the honest side of it, and so this is where we give examples of that. Speaker 2 (10:22) Yeah, well... Fresh off finishing up the tour and, you know, six weeks, basically six weekends off over the year, I come back into town last night and start offering parenting advice. Wow. Speaker 3 (10:34) Straight off the Speaker 2 (10:35) bat, which was probably welcoming. Well, it was actually, it was, I just, I don't know what I was thinking. I think I just came in, the routine had changed and I thought I'd offer my thoughts on the routine changed. Oh, Speaker 3 (10:51) I see. Speaker 2 (10:52) And it's more my partner, Henry, just looked at me. He was like, you've just been away, mate, for days on end. And I just thought it made me think of Dolly Parton and Dolly would say something like, honey, you weren't wrong. You just weren't in charge. This is off the back of Dolly obviously passing recently. And I was just thinking about, yeah, I just lowered my colours. I was like, oh, why are we doing things in this order? You know, I've just been four nights away or something like that. And I just thought. What a jerk. And so I didn't do my best and I was rushing people to do things. And yeah, I just came off Speaker 3 (11:26) as a vlog. Yeah, okay. Speaker 2 (11:28) Which is no good. So that was my Griswold for the week. Speaker 3 (11:31) Yeah, okay. Speaker 2 (11:32) What a jerk. Yeah, the blow Speaker 3 (11:33) -in. And do you know Dolly Parton has a program Speaker 2 (11:36) that's been running for years and years and years of giving free books to kids all over the world? 150 million books. Yeah, isn't that wild? Yeah. Speaker 3 (11:43) And it's in Australia as well. Speaker 2 (11:44) Didn't know that. Speaker 3 (11:45) Yeah. Yeah, I met with a guy, I'm just trying to remember his name, a lovely guy in Tassie who's leading it down there. Speaker 2 (11:50) Gotcha. Speaker 3 (11:51) Yes, my Griswold happened yesterday. I'm a bit like you. I've had one day with my kids in the last seven because I've been travelling so much. Speaker 3 (12:03) If I'm being 100 % honest, Evie and Charlie were at each other a bit, I reckon because I'd blown in. So five-year-old Yvette, three-year-old Charlie, and I had Heidi, one-year-old as well. And we were kind of moving through the house. But if I'm being 100 % honest, I was mainly on my phone, which Speaker 2 (12:19) is pretty Speaker 3 (12:19) embarrassing thinking that I've been away for so long and I've been in my comms so much and on the socials so much and everything like that and the small pocket of window I had with them. Speaker 3 (12:30) And Charlie's pretty sensitive at the moment and Evie was kind of pushing his buttons. Speaker 3 (12:36) And I was walking around playing with them with my phone on it the whole time and I really had a go at Evie. I was just like, I really came down on her about it. And then probably about 30 seconds later I had a go at her because I'd told her a couple of times to like, you know, if I'm being 100 % honest, I'd just come down and threatened punishments and stuff, which is bad because, yeah, I was drained but I hadn't been present with them at all for a week. And, yeah, I yelled at her and was like. I've told you, like, not to do that to him if you're ignoring me. And the truth is that, yeah, I was on my phone. Speaker 2 (13:14) Yeah. Speaker 3 (13:15) Do you know what you did to me the other day as well? I'll just give you an extra one. I was walking through the supermarket Speaker 2 (13:20) with Speaker 3 (13:21) all three of them and I was on my phone and Evie Calum slapped it out of my hand. Yeah, serious. Crossed the aisle. And there were people in the aisle and I just looked at her with shock and surprise and was like, and she looked at me. And I was like, Evie. Did you know what she did? What? She went and got it, handed it back to me and said, sorry. And I said, she's like, no, because when she slapped out of my hand, she said, you're always on your phone. So I looked at her and said, Evie. She went and got it, picked it up, handed it back to me and said a genuine sorry. She was like, sorry. And I was like, that's okay, beautiful. I was like, and you're right, I'm always on my phone, but you can't hit it out of my hand and I'm going to try and be better. And I said, but you know what? I'm trying to find the ingredients for Rocky Road. Which, let's be honest, is not a complex recipe. It's like melted chocolate and marshmallows and peanuts. So anyway, those, yeah, that's kind of, yeah, that's the biggest thing I'm doing at Speaker 2 (14:22) the Speaker 3 (14:22) moment. Got Speaker 2 (14:22) to Speaker 3 (14:22) put the phone down. Yeah, I'm always, I'm too embarrassed to say my average daily screen time. Speaker 2 (14:27) I don't. I wouldn't want to know. Yeah, yeah. I don't want to know. My phone still tells me. Speaker 3 (14:32) So I need to figure out how to turn that off until I sort it out. Got a Winslow? Carl Winslow. So Carl Winslow is our Speaker 1 (14:37) highlight. Speaker 3 (14:37) I don't object to Speaker 1 (14:38) phone. I love fun. In fact, I'm the grand funk master of fun. Speaker 3 (14:46) Yeah, so Carl, yeah, not a perfect, but a present trying dad. And this is our highlights. What have you got? Yeah, I've got a pretty important one, actually. It's kind of on topic. Speaker 3 (14:59) Yeah, I've been struggling lately. It's really interesting. You know what I didn't talk about in the anger episodes is that agitation and anger is often my sign that my depression is re-emerging. Okay. Yeah, that makes sense. Speaker 2 (15:14) Yeah. I Speaker 3 (15:14) mean, it's a clinical feature of it, but it's often my barometer. My truest barometer is not like not being interested in other stuff, being flat and not sleeping well, that kind of stuff because I never sleep well. But the... Yeah, and I've been really just struggling with the uncertainty like of where we're going to live next year, what we're going to do in the social enterprise, this career and what's going on with my kids and all this stuff. So I've been just getting really easily agitated and do you know what I did recently? I actually apologized to Annalise and it was just this like, yeah, it was this amazing. Speaker 3 (15:50) because it was just almost instantly connecting and like this idea of just like, yeah. And it's just, it's really interesting because I often talk in the parenting workshops we do and I've been doing a lot of talks trying to make the social enterprise sustainable financially about Speaker 2 (16:09) how we never saw Speaker 3 (16:10) our parents or our teachers say sorry. And just how it was seen as it's a weakness to say sorry. But it's actually a strength, isn't it? When you think about it. And I reckon that's how Evie has learnt it. Not by me telling her to say sorry, but her understanding why. And then she said sorry to me. You know? And then I accepted it and praised her for it and gave it space and power. You know, so yeah, that was just, yeah, it was just a really quite profound experience for me, which is ridiculous. A man saying, how great am I? I said, sorry. But it's more Speaker 2 (16:52) just the point Speaker 3 (16:53) of it that like, yeah, and it's on topic as well. Speaker 2 (16:56) Is it? Yeah. Anything else to cover off before we kick things off? No, Speaker 3 (17:00) what about me? You don't have a... Speaker 2 (17:02) No, no Winslow's. No Winslow's. No, pretty dry spell in victories. Yeah, okay. Well, I haven't done anything over and above. So I've just been asked what are you up to? I'm just potty along is what I keep saying. Speaker 3 (17:17) Well, your Winslow is going to come in this episode. Speaker 2 (17:20) Oh, is it? Speaker 3 (17:20) Yeah. Speaker 2 (17:21) Oh, okay. So you'll have to wait for it. I'll give you a Winslow. Okay. That's good. I like those. Now the Lost Boys. The Lost Boys. This is like top ten films you love? Yeah, I love this movie. Why? Speaker 3 (17:36) Well, because it connects to me like my older brother who was kind of like Michael. Speaker 4 (17:41) It Speaker 3 (17:41) was kind of like Michael. Like he was a lot older and it was his era. He really liked this movie. You know, I saw this movie too young. Same. So yeah, classic. Like, you know, Keith is phenomenal. Keith Sutherland is great in Stand By Me. There's obviously other characters in Stand By Me and there's some phenomenal acting. Keith Sutherland's hardly in it. There's hardly any lines, but he's so powerful when he walks through the video store. Hell of a look. Yeah, hell of a look. All those boys have got a hell of a look. The vampire crew. Speaker 2 (18:10) Yeah. Speaker 3 (18:11) They're just like, yeah. Speaker 2 (18:12) Which one would you be if you Speaker 3 (18:14) were going to be one of the vampire boys? I'd Speaker 2 (18:15) be Bill. Oh, really? The curly haired one. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He gets killed first. Speaker 3 (18:21) Spoiler. If I couldn't be Keefer, because I just love him in this, the other blonde one. Speaker 2 (18:27) Oh, yeah? It's like, Speaker 3 (18:28) it's got such an iconic look. Speaker 2 (18:30) I reckon I'd be Corey Feldman. Yeah, Feldman, not Speaker 3 (18:34) home. Speaker 2 (18:34) Loved his character. Yeah, Speaker 3 (18:36) not Speaker 2 (18:36) home. Yeah. Speaker 3 (18:37) No, I was always Speaker 2 (18:37) a Feldman, not home. Frog Brothers sort of man. Speaker 3 (18:40) Yeah. Speaker 2 (18:41) Yeah, Speaker 3 (18:42) it's really interesting and obviously Diane's in this. Speaker 2 (18:44) Yeah, I know. She's amazing. So young in it as well. I mean, the film is 39 years old. Speaker 3 (18:50) Yeah, yeah. Speaker 2 (18:51) That's a long time ago. Yeah, yeah. Speaker 3 (18:54) Yeah, it is. It's totally, sadly, it is a long time ago, but it is really interesting and I think it's quite a powerful, important movie as well. I think the themes in it, and I don't know if you know much about this, but obviously for people who don't know, The Lost Boys is a vampire movie about the family of a single mum that goes with two boys to move to, I don't know what they call it. Santa Clara. Santa Clara, that's right. Santa