112.00 Christina Wallace on Being intentional about a Portfolio Life

Play to Potential Podcast

Christina Wallace discusses how a Portfolio Life can replace the pressure of one linear career by treating identity as a Human Venn Diagram and work as a seasonally

Key takeaways

• Christina Wallace defines a Human Venn Diagram as skills, interests, experiences, perspectives, passions, and pursuits that make each person unique beyond their current job title.
• She frames the four pillars of a Portfolio Life as identity, optionality, diversification, and flexibility, using financial portfolio logic to explain seasonal rebalancing.

Main topics

• Portfolio Life and Human Venn Diagram
• Identity versus job title

Notable quotes

I call myself a human Venn diagram.

Conclusion

The episode offers a practical framework for leaders and professionals to design careers

Transcript preview

Speaker 3 (0:00) You know, I often get asked the question of like, do you really want your neurosurgeon to have a side hustle? Like, where is specialization kind of in this model? But my answer is always like, yeah, I do. Maybe not monetize. Maybe it's just a hobby. But I want anyone operating on me to have other things in their life such that on the day they wake up and think, I don't really want to operate anymore. They don't then come to work because they have nothing else to go to. Right. I don't want them staying for 10 years beyond their prime because if they if they retire, they lose their community. They lose their identity. They lose what they get out of bed every day to do. Right. I want them to be like, yeah, I go play trombone in this great bass brass band. And I'm on the board of this nonprofit and I'm thinking of writing my great American novel. And the day I no longer want to be a neurosurgeon is the day I stop. Speaker 5 (1:09) Solve large, intractable problems. Speaker 2 (1:12) It's a new venture altogether. Your Speaker 5 (1:14) brain is a wild horse there. Because remember, writing is not a team sport. You are not selling horse carriages when there are cars. Speaker 1 (1:21) I want to be known only as a trusted advisor. More like a tourist. Speaker 4 (1:31) Welcome Speaker 5 (1:40) to the next conversation at the Play to Potential podcast. I'm your host Deepak Jayaraman and we've been curating this podcast since 2016 and we are curious about three themes, leadership, transitions and careers. And if you've been following our work, you probably know that I'm curious about how to think about potential in a holistic sense. And one mechanism which is becoming more and more popular, especially with people in their 40s, 50s and 60s, is this notion of a portfolio life. And while I've heard many people use it loosely, I thought it would be a great opportunity for us to get a little more structure around how do we construct a portfolio? How do we rebalance our portfolio as we go through life? And how do we measure ourselves as we go on our portfolio life? Because if you're doing one thing, one job, it's very often quite easy to measure progress. But if you're doing a bunch of things, how do you really figure out if you're on the right track and if you're making meaningful progress? In this context, I'm excited to present the next conversation with Professor Christina Wallace of Harvard Business School, who studied this notion of living a portfolio life and has a book with the same title. In this conversation, we'll explore many of the things I mentioned around portfolio construction and measurement. She even goes on to say why Michelle Obama might be a great example for us to think about our portfolios as we evolve. Without further ado, let's listen and learn from Professor Christina Wallace of Harvard Business School. Christina, lovely to have you at the Play to Potential podcast. Thank you so much for making the time. Speaker 3 (3:22) Thank you for having me. I'm delighted to be here. Speaker 5 (3:26) And as we move into the future, I think the idea of a portfolio life, I think is just becoming more and more real for many more of us. So really, really excited to explore the various themes around the portfolio life. But before we get there, Christina, it's useful to understand people journeys and how they get to, you know, a certain point in terms of the curiosity. I'm curious about maybe your journey and maybe if you want to talk about some of your key choices and transitions in your journey. which have gotten you to a point where you've gotten curious about the portfolio life? Speaker 3 (3:58) Sure. I mean, I can give you the very short version or we could spend the whole hour on this. I not so jokingly say I wrote this book to explain to my mother what I've been doing with my career my entire life. I was the kid who never wanted to just pick one thing. And so all the way through my education, through... you know, through grade school and high school, I was a total math nerd, loved it all, competed on the math team, but also loved storytelling and writing. And I studied classical music, piano, cello, and voice, and really wasn't interested in just picking one. So I got to college and my particular university, Emory University, It allowed you to take as many classes as you could handle, basically, for the exact same price. Like there was no extra tuition if you wanted to take 23 credits than if you took 12. And so I, paying for my own education, decided to get my money's worth. And I double majored in math and theater. I double minored, triple minored in physics, music and political science. And like still then didn't want. to choose. And so, you know, as I've built my adult life, my professional career, I have zigged and zagged in a way that if you looked at my LinkedIn, you would have absolutely no Speaker 2 (5:30) idea what was going on. Speaker 3 (5:32) But underneath, there was always laying the groundwork for the next chapter while living the current chapter because I have all of these different. So I had a first season as a theater director and as an arts administrator at the Metropolitan Opera. Then I went off to business school. While I was there, the world fell apart, 2008 financial crisis. And it became quite clear careers in the arts were not going to be all that stable and plentiful. And I made this transition into the tech world to do startups. I had always been a mathematician. I had learned how to code as part of my education. And so going and building companies felt very similar to building plays. It was just using a different language and a different set of tools. But a lot of the principles were the same. And while I was building startups, I sang in acapella groups and performed and worked with various theaters and still kept that in my life. I didn't monetize that as my profession. And then a big part of my growing and existing in the tech world somehow became education. I built a startup focused on girls and computer science and got really involved in how to advocate for getting more women entrepreneurs, getting more funding for them. And so it probably should be no surprise when I go and then have a chapter as a professor. And while I am, you know, professing, I'm also still writing stories. I'm still building things. Now I'm producing on Broadway as my fun side hobby. Doing many of the things that I did building a company, but now I'm building a production company. Speaker 3 (7:30) And so getting to like mix and remix these various skills. I call myself a human Venn diagram. And it's very consistent with that where I have this handful of interests and I just, I remix which of them and in what proportion for each chapter of my career. Speaker 5 (7:49) Beautiful, beautiful. And let's maybe... So build on that. When you say Venn diagram, can you talk a little bit about how we should think about the circles? You know, are the circles skills? Are the circles interests? Are they something else? In the book, you sort of lay out the different frames with which you can think about the circles of the Venn diagram. But I'd love for you to talk a little bit Speaker 3 (8:10) about how each one of us can Speaker 5 (8:12) construct our own Venn diagram. Speaker 3 (8:15) It was an excellent question. The idea of the Venn diagram is really rooted in the ability to define yourself, to craft your identity separate from your current job title. Certainly here in the U.S., we really closely build an identity to our jobs. And certainly the higher you go up, the more successful you are as a leader, I think the more calcified. that identity becomes. I am the CEO of, the CMO of, the leader of. And that's really dangerous in a world that is changing this much because you could lose your income and your identity in the same conversation. So really emphasizing the opportunity to build an identity separate from your current chapter of your profession, but also to Remind yourself that you are more than just what you do right now. So many of us have all these different interests and skill sets and perspectives that give us a unique mix of how we see the world. That when you step into a room or you join a team, even if you have the same education as someone else, even if you came from the same town as someone else, You, by definition, are going to see the world differently and you're going to add something differently. And so the circles, I started in my own definition thinking about industries, right? So I described my career at the intersection of business technology and the arts. But it quickly became clear that that wasn't the only way you could define your circles. There are other elements around skills like storytelling. storytelling is absolutely one of my circles. And that shows up in my writing. It shows up in my public speaking. I had a podcast for a while. I think very deeply about coaching through storytelling, getting people to find their own story and discover the truths about themselves. So that's a skill, not an industry. But then there's also like experiences that I think are relevant. I grew up in a working class family. I then worked in the nonprofit arts world where there was never enough money. And so my approach to anything is going to be informed by the fact that I know how to make magic out of $7 and a roll of duct tape. And I'm not even, I'm not scared by that. I'm sometimes inspired by that. That is in fact what connected me so much to early stage startups when I made that pivot in business school. So that grittiness and that willingness and comfort level with minimal resources, no safety net, and you still have to make it happen, I think that's in my Venn diagram too. So I really encourage folks as they're kind of crafting this out to think, sure, about the jobs you've had and the skills you've... built and the worlds that you've been a professional in, but to also really think about all these other things, your hobbies, your childhood, your perspectives. If you're someone who constantly is interested in traveling the world and trying new foods, adventurer might be part of this. And being stuck in the same job day after day might be the worst thing that could happen to you. Speaker 3 (11:56) It's not a clear answer. I will give you that. But I think the lack of limitations can really give you the benefit of seeing all of your different. Speaker 3 (12:12) dimensions, especially, and this is, I mentioned this in the book, for seasoned leaders who have been doing their lives, their careers for quite some time. I imagine there are elements of your Venn diagram that you sort of carved off and probably put away maybe decades ago when you had to sort of grow up and become serious, right? You had to focus to say that was cute. That was a thing I liked, whatever in school, but there's no place for that now. Speaker 3 (12:51) that's still part of you and you're probably feeling the loss of it, especially when it compounds over time. So I worked with two leaders. At the same time, they didn't know each other, but they had the exact same story, which was that they had been artists all the way through school. One was a painter, one was a sculptor. And then they became CMOs. Speaker 3 (13:19) Parents, mothers, both of them were women. They became grownups with families and responsibilities and lives. And neither of them had made any art in decades. But they had gone into advertising because that was the closest ability to be around art while still being a grown up. And three decades into their careers, it wasn't enough. They were really feeling the loss of the absence of this art. And they were struggling. Do I leave my job? Do I like go and blow everything up and try something new? And as we worked together, we realized some of the opportunity was, can we carve out space for you to make art? Like, can we bring that in back into your life? Can you have a studio? Can you protect Saturday morning? Like, do you have to blow up your life? Or can you just make space for this piece of you that you really feel the loss of? And I think it was surprising to them that that was... allowed, right? That that was okay. Which I think is more to the mindset of how we built careers over the last few decades than it does to any individual person. Speaker 5 (14:48) Yeah, I think one of the people I spoke to at the podcast was a gentleman called Lloyd Reeb. He runs what's called a halftime institute where he helps people move from success to significance. And he had an interesting quote. He said, sometimes you need to lift the blankets. You know, people come to me with, you know, smoldering coals Speaker 3 (15:10) covered Speaker 5 (15:11) with wet blankets. And sometimes I just need to remove the wet blankets of responsibility or time constraints or whatever, and then blow some oxygen. And then some of these things suddenly come alive. I Speaker 3 (15:22) love that metaphor. Yeah. Speaker 5 (15:25) I had a related question, just staying with this Venn diagram. You know, one is, I mean, the sense I get is yours is like the Olympic Games, right? There are a few rings and then you're sort of moving across different rings and at different stages of life, different things take center stage and the rings evolve as you go through life's experiences. The other school of thought sometimes I hear, Christina, is, you know, this notion of skill stacking. Almost Venn diagrams, but try and stack them up in a way that there is a sweet spot which is at the intersection of multiple circles and then, in a way... then you're sort of, you're distinctive in a playground of one. And there's an opportunity to play that. How do you think about skill stacking in the context of your views on portfolio life? Speaker 3 (16:08) Yeah, I mean, it's not inconsistent. I think the one thing that I still struggle with the idea of skill stacking is that it's still, as much as I understand the model, it's still looking for like, what's that one thing Speaker 4 (16:22) that Speaker 3 (16:23) I can be one of one in? Speaker 2 (16:26) And Speaker 3 (16:26) my research, certainly my own life, continues to prove that being one anything is both really risky, even when you can find that sort of sweet spot between all these different circles. But it's also one dimensional for yourself. Like we are not just one thing, even if you can. thread that needle and say, well, I'm going to be this thing within these six different industries that I can zig and zag doing that thing. All of us still have these like three other components of us. And I think it is both wasted strategy to let those other pieces of you atrophy. But I think it's also part of like what gives you inspiration, what passes new ideas. We see this in the research of innovation that a lot of the best ideas are not net new. They're just like stolen from one world and applied to the next. And so by focusing and by finding that, you know, one of one skill through through these different worlds, I think you're still missing out on like what happens if. You, the surfer, world traveler mother, happens to be the head of people development. And what do you see by having these different pieces of you that you not only are, but you recognize that you are? And because so much of this, and maybe you see this in your coaching, is like the stories that we tell ourselves about ourselves. can either be really limiting Speaker 3 (18:18) or hugely expansive? Speaker 5 (18:20) It's Speaker 3 (18:21) a Speaker 5 (18:21) great point. I think I completely agree with you. I think there's one piece around talent market fit where we need to figure out what skills to bring to the world and what can be fun, joyful, and commercially meaningful. But I think the other piece is also leading a full life. Yes. And to your point, just focusing on that one thing, I think there might be many facets of us like you spoke about that painter and the sculptor. You need to just sort of find a way of expressing the various facets of who we are, whether it's commercially meaningful or as a hobby or as a person with kids. And I Speaker 3 (18:54) think related to that, you know, I often get asked the question of like, do you really want your neurosurgeon to have a side hustle? Like where is specialization kind of in this model? But my answer is always like, yeah, I do. Maybe not monetize, maybe it's just a hobby, but I want anyone operating on me. to have other things in their life such that. On the day they wake up and think, I don't really want to operate anymore, they don't then come to work because they have nothing else to go to. I don't want them staying for 10 years beyond their prime because if they retire, they lose their community, they lose their identity, they lose what they get out of bed every day to do. I want them to be like, yeah, I go play trombone. in this great brass band, and I'm on the board of this nonprofit, and I'm thinking of writing my great American novel. And the day I no longer want to be a neurosurgeon is the day I stop being a neurosurgeon, right? Like, you look at American leadership, and we've got... Speaker 3 (20:07) thousands of leaders who have stayed past their moment because they have nothing else to go to. And so they're Speaker 5 (20:17) holding on. Speaker 3 (20:17) That's a wonderful Speaker 5 (20:17) training, actually. If somebody's multifaceted, then they choose to continue the profession. So in a way, they're still relevant. Speaker 3 (20:24) Exactly. Speaker 5 (20:25) That's a great point. I mean, the other example that comes to mind is just because Albert Einstein played the violin, it didn't make him a lesser physicist, right? Speaker 5 (20:35) So with you, with you. Just maybe getting into the nuts and bolts of the portfolio life, Christina, you speak about four pillars, Speaker 3 (20:44) identity, Speaker 5 (20:46) optionality, diversification, and flexibility. Speaker 4 (20:48) Can you sort of give us a sense of what you mean by these terms in Speaker 5 (20:52) the context of a portfolio life? Speaker 3 (20:54) Sure. So identity is the piece that we've been talking about up to this point, right? It's all about understanding who you are and allowing it to be as expansive. as you actually are. And acknowledging that even if you're not using every single piece of you in any given chapter of your life, it doesn't go away. It is just at a 0 % allocation, right? I think about this, if you're building, literally, this was where the model came from, a financial portfolio, you could have accounts in your portfolio that are just currently at a 0 % allocation. I'm not going to put any... of my finances into real estate for the next 10 years. I'm going to focus elsewhere. It doesn't mean real estate ceases to exist. So you start with your identity and you have this understanding of who you are. And then that makes it really easy for pillar two, optionality. It makes it easy to see you have options, right? You're not backed into the wall. You're not stuck because so much of The ability to zig and zag in a world that changes is you recognizing that you can zig and zag, right? Your feet are not locked in cement. But if you don't see yourself as anything other than what you currently do, you look at a world that is facing disruption, you think, oh my God, I'm going to be obsolete. Like what I, if my thing ceases to exist, I'm done. As opposed to recognizing like there are 72 other doors. that you could walk. It just requires you to remix what you're doing. So that's optionality. So much of this is just you have to see that you have options. And that leads us to diversification. Speaker 5 (22:43) Because Speaker 3 (22:43) in a world that is changing this rapidly and has this many unknowns with such limited visibility. Speaker 3 (22:54) The only way to future-proof is to diversify. You can't plan for things that you can't see. And so this actually, it comes out of Clay Christensen's work, who was one of my professors when I was at business school, who wrote a lot about, within corporate innovation, this idea of emergent versus deliberate strategy. And deliberate strategy worked in a world where you could see... What was happening? You knew who your competitors were, knew who your customers were. You understood what the technology was going to look like. And you could plot out three, five, 10 year plans. Speaker 4 (23:33) But Speaker 3 (23:34) in a world under disruption where your competitor set might be changing faster than you can see, your customers may not look like they used to. The technology, good Lord, the technology changes every three months. You can't plan 10 years in it because you can't see that far ahead. So you have to be much more emergent. You have to take a step, look around, see what new information you have, take another step. And I think it's the same idea within diversification. You can't plan for the future because the future is unknown. So don't put all your eggs in one basket and constantly look for the information you need and like let that feed into. How you are actively balancing and rebalancing those allocations. And that brings us to the last pillar, which was the flexibility. Part of my