547 - Always on the Precipice

My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark

In episode 547 of My Favorite Murder, Karen Kilgariff explores the case of Mona Fandey, known as the 'Witch Doctor' murderer, while Georgia

Key takeaways

• Mona Fandey's case highlights how manipulation and deception can lead to extreme violence under the guise of spiritual authority.

Main topics

• True crime cases
• Mona Fandey (Witch Doctor murderer)

Notable quotes

Cindy said I had to choose between the truth and my family, and I had to choose the truth.

Conclusion

The episode emphasizes the unpredictable nature of human behavior and the profound

Transcript preview

Speaker 4 (0:01) This is exactly right. Speaker 4 (0:06) I'm Nancy Glass, host of the Burden of Guilt Season 3 podcast. This is a story about a horrendous situation that destroyed two families. It's a scorched earth war that shows just how far someone will go to get what they want. Speaker 3 (0:21) Cindy said I had to choose between the truth and my family, and I had to choose the truth. Speaker 4 (0:27) Listen to Season 3 of Burden of Guilt on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome aboard season Speaker 6 (0:37) six of The Girlfriends, Flight or Fight, which takes place 30,000 feet in the sky. A beautiful woman smiles and hands you a scotch, but you have no idea just how messed up her job actually is. It was the most sexist job I think you could have. Until one day, a group of stewardesses spark a revolution that reshapes America. Listen to The Girlfriends, Flight or Fight, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And Speaker 2 (1:33) welcome to My Favorite Murder. That's Georgia Hardstart. That's Karen Kilgariff. And we're here to podcast at you. Always and forever. That's the contract we signed. With the devil. Come Speaker 1 (1:43) with me. To hell. To podcast for the rest of your life. Listen, Speaker 8 (1:48) I shouldn't have said to hell. Yeah. We love it here. Oh, wow. I love how. It's the best. Do you ever kind of do secretary actions knowing that you don't have to do any secretary jobs? There's Speaker 1 (1:59) definitely just moments throughout my day where I think, thank fucking God this is my life. For real. So grateful. My Speaker 8 (2:06) passion that I discovered in sixth grade, which is reading aloud, is my job. And talking as Speaker 1 (2:13) much as you want. All the time. Speaker 8 (2:15) Yeah. All the reasons. Yeah. Talking here, conversationally. Yeah. Go ahead and reading off of here. Just read your thing. Yeah. That's pretty great. And now you can too. Take our course. Speaker 2 (2:25) For only Speaker 8 (2:25) $400. Speaker 2 (2:28) We're selling something. Yeah, we are. Yeah, it's great. Why is this bothering me? Okay. Everyone's selling something and those who say they aren't are lying. That's right. A Speaker 5 (2:37) quote from... Speaker 2 (2:38) What? Speaker 5 (2:39) Grimace. Speaker 2 (2:40) Oh. I can't remember who it is. Who's Speaker 1 (2:42) Grimace? Didn't get that. Sorry. Speaker 8 (2:45) That was the grimmest part was the joke too. I had a really, really big mocha frappuccino before I Speaker 7 (2:50) came Speaker 8 (2:51) here. Speaker 7 (2:51) I had a pouch from a new brand in my gum that's supposed to give me energy. Skull? No, it's not nicotine. It's like... Speaker 8 (3:01) A little energy pouch. Speaker 2 (3:02) Neurotropic. What's it feel like? I feel good so far. Okay. I feel like it's working. Are you seeing multiplication in front of you and you're solving it? I know how to play chess now. What? Speaker 8 (3:12) Okay, I got to go. Yeah. Speaker 2 (3:14) That's what I'm selling. Okay. Cheek pouch enhancers? Energy cheek pouches. I'm like Gen Z. Speaker 1 (3:20) I'm so young. Speaker 2 (3:22) You're down by the old Farmville. I don't know any Speaker 8 (3:27) of the games people play. Speaker 1 (3:29) Speaking of games, want to hear something funny? Yes. Vince Averill, my one and only husband. So you say. Speaker 5 (3:36) Is Speaker 1 (3:36) now in a band. with Marcus Parks from last podcast. No. Speaker 2 (3:42) They're in a fucking band together. And now you can too. That's fucking amazing. Speaker 1 (3:48) He plays golf with Chris Fairbanks and he's in a band with Marcus. What does Marcus play? He plays drums. Speaker 2 (3:54) That's badass. Speaker 1 (3:55) They're like good. Speaker 2 (3:56) Will you please invite me when they do a show? Of course. Speaker 1 (3:59) I don't know when it's going to Speaker 8 (4:00) happen, but yes, of course. Did they just start? Speaker 1 (4:02) No, they've had quite a few practices. Is Speaker 8 (4:05) it like the heavy metal that Vince is so interested in or whatever they call it? No, it's a little more melodic. Oh. Speaker 7 (4:11) This isn't the case, but it reminds me like Vince used to jam with his friends in New York for no reason. And one of their girlfriends called it smoking pot practice. They were playing electronic back then. This is different. This Speaker 1 (4:27) is different. So I'll let everyone know. They're going to Speaker 7 (4:29) be Speaker 1 (4:29) opening Speaker 7 (4:29) for us. Speaker 1 (4:30) I thought you'd get a kick out of that. I love it. Speaker 8 (4:32) That's really badass. Speaker 1 (4:33) Should we tell everyone that we have a podcast network in case they don't know? Speaker 8 (4:36) No, I think we should keep it a secret. Speaker 1 (4:38) It's called Exactly Right Media. Here are some highlights from it. We've Speaker 8 (4:42) got a little show called Disgraceland. You may have heard of it. The great Jake Brennan this week Speaker 5 (4:47) will be telling the story of Alice Bagg, who is an underground feminist icon of L.A.'s early punk scene. It's set against the terrifying backdrop of the Hillside Stranglers. I cover them on episode 114, Civic Order. Speaker 1 (4:59) And speaking of familiar cases, over on Hollywoodland, Speaker 7 (5:02) Jake tells the story of Rodney Alcala, the dating game killer, absolute monster. I covered that case back on episode 54 called Valet Area. What Speaker 1 (5:12) was Speaker 8 (5:12) going on in those titles? Don't know. They don't seem familiar. Then, over on Wicked Words, Kate Speaker 5 (5:17) Winkler Dawson welcomes back Dawson Fearnow to discuss the state of Arizona's secret role in the Federal Witness Protection Program. Amazing topic. Speaker 1 (5:26) Arizona, you got Speaker 8 (5:27) some explaining to do. It's no secret. We've seen all those 80s movies. They dig into the stories of mob informants who were given new identities but couldn't manage to stay out of trouble. Speaker 1 (5:37) That's where the movie My Blue Heaven starts. Yes. Isn't that exact? That's right. Fear Now is such a rad last name, isn't it? Yeah. And on brief recess, Speaker 7 (5:47) Michael and Melissa address all of the online buzz around Michael joining the new season of The Traitors, including the most important question, did Alan Cumming like him best? Of course he did. How do you not? I mean, the two of them together, get them a sitcom. Speaker 2 (6:03) It's happening. These couches are Speaker 7 (6:04) working. Plus, they break down the Supreme Court's rejection Speaker 1 (6:07) of Trump's appeal involving the $5 million judgment he owes E. Jean Carroll. Speaker 5 (6:12) Yeah, go listen to that. Important stuff. Yes, Speaker 1 (6:14) absolutely. And Speaker 5 (6:15) then another Bravo leb graced this network this week over on I Said No Gifts. Bridger welcomes back comedian and host of Bravo's Love Hotel. And despite Joel once again arriving with a gift on the show, they chop it up about car accidents, threats from space, and salad. Speaker 1 (6:31) Love all those things. Sure. And in the merch corner, we have a brand new... license plate frame. It says, my favorite murder. This is terrible. Keep going. Speaker 7 (6:40) Do we need to put these on our cars? You Speaker 8 (6:42) know, I'm not much for wearing your own merch. That's true. That's my stance. And Speaker 7 (6:46) it's Speaker 1 (6:47) just in time for National Traffic Awareness Month. You know how much we, you know how passionate we are. Every year. Every year we tell you. We Speaker 2 (6:54) sit Speaker 1 (6:54) you Speaker 2 (6:54) down and we say, it is traffic awareness. You know what? It's been in your calendar. Stop ignoring it. Speaker 1 (6:59) With a Speaker 2 (6:59) little cupcake Speaker 1 (7:00) for months. Get aware. How Speaker 2 (7:02) dare Speaker 7 (7:02) you? What's happening? A little Speaker 1 (7:03) cupcake. Speaker 7 (7:05) Keep going. Drive safely and grab yours at exactlyrightstore.com. And if you see me driving Speaker 1 (7:12) my borrowed Hyundai, Speaker 7 (7:14) throw Speaker 1 (7:14) me a cupcake. Speaker 2 (7:17) Wow. This is working. Get that pouch out of your mouth and stop it. Your water is moments from fucking Speaker 1 (7:24) falling over. There's some out of it. Speaker 2 (7:29) There we go. Speaker 4 (7:30) It's always on the precipice. I'm Nancy Glass, host of the Burden of Guilt Season 3 podcast. This is a story about a horrendous situation that destroyed two families. It started more than seven years ago when Cindy and Kenny were two 40-somethings who had just gotten engaged. Days later, they walked into a scorched earth war they never saw coming. Speaker 6 (7:57) The cops came into my house and threw me in jail. Speaker 4 (8:00) And to Cindy's surprise, her fiance, Kenny, was charged with abusing one of her children. I Speaker 3 (8:06) never once doubted Kenny, and I always doubted the accusation. Speaker 4 (8:11) On Season 3 of Burden of Guilt, you'll hear a story about the lengths someone will go to in order to get what they want. Speaker 6 (8:19) This case has got to be one of the most despicable. Speaker 4 (8:22) Listen to Season 3 of Burden of Guilt on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Speaker 2 (8:34) Okay. I'm first. Yeah. Get out of my way. I'm going to sit here quietly like Speaker 8 (8:39) I always do. I'm going to tell you a little story that I had heard of like distantly. Speaker 5 (8:45) This Speaker 8 (8:45) is one of those like. Speaker 5 (8:47) a faraway forensic files kind of memory that you have. And it's interesting the truth behind it. Okay, it's July 2nd, 1993, and we're in Pahang, Malaysia, and an ambitious 49-year-old state assemblyman named Maslin Idris is nowhere to be found. Maslin is a busy guy, so his family is used to going even sometimes full days without hearing from him. But now several days have passed and they're worried, so he's reported missing to the police. 20 days later, on July 22nd, his remains are found. And there are three people that suspicions fall on. But in the media frenzy that follows, only one of them becomes the enduring face of this case. That person's name is Mona Fendi. And this is one of the most notorious true crime cases in Malaysian history. This is the story of the witch doctor murders, the murder of Maslin. Oh, my God. The main sources used today are articles from the Malaysian newspapers The Star and The New Straits Times, as well as reporting by Mitzi Zerretto. And the rest of them are in our show notes. Now it's January of 1956, and a baby named Mazna Ismail is born into a small conservative community. As she grows up, she gets really into singing and performing, and she fantasizes about moving to a big city and getting famous. And although she does take a more conventional path in life by marrying and having a child, she never gives up on that dream. She never lets go of it. But by the time she's 30, she's divorced and raising her baby, Diana, alone. And that is until she meets 29-year-old sound engineer Mohamed Afandi Abdul Rahman. In most reporting, they refer to him as Afandi. And so that's what I'll call him, too. Mazna and Afandi have this whirlwind romance, and they're married very soon after they meet. And she likes to call her new husband her number one fan, and Afandi is ready and eager to use his music industry knowledge and connections to make her a star. So it's the perfect love story. And this is when Mazna decides that she needs a stage name. So she renames herself Mona Fendi. And that's an homage to her husband, who is now her manager as well, because it sounds like his name, Mohamed Afendi. Speaker 1 (11:13) So Speaker 5 (11:13) in 1987, the couple records and self-releases Mona's debut album. She names it Diana One. Oh, Speaker 1 (11:21) I love Speaker 5 (11:21) it. Speaker 1 (11:21) There's Mona. Mona has jewelry goals, like the gold bangles and gold necklaces and stuff. Speaker 8 (11:27) Also, Mona looks like she's in Tropic Thunder. She does. In a way that is shocking and hilarious. It's Speaker 2 (11:34) a lot of Speaker 8 (11:34) ladies. Speaker 7 (11:35) But Speaker 8 (11:35) this one's for Diana. Diana number one. She's number one. So it isn't, as you had guessed, it isn't a chart topper, but Speaker 5 (11:42) a few of her songs actually do get airtime in Malaysia. Afandi even manages to book her on a couple of TV shows, although that doesn't really go anywhere. So a few years pass and basically nothing pans out. So Mona decides she's going to change course. She puts the music business behind her and both she and Afandi pivot to shamanism. Okay. That's right. Now, in Malaysia, there's a long cultural tradition of shamanism. Their word for it is bomo. And bomos use their connection to the spiritual world to offer traditional medicines through conducting rituals and talismans. Some of them even practice magic in the hope of addressing the person, their client's issues. The clients ask for help improving physical health, attracting a romantic partner, growing their net worth, the standard stuff that you go to. anyone for, really, for help. So it's kind of unclear what would put someone on that career path, although a relative of Afandi's will later say that he had a strong interest in mysticism and that he studied, himself studied, under various bomos. But many sources are a little more cynical about the couple's motives, and they basically just accuse the Jew of opportunism, probably because they target rich people. Sure. So Mona ingratiates herself with wealthy potential clients by lying about her connections to Malaysian royalty, just like I do. We all can. Speaker 2 (13:12) You always do. It works. You got to manifest that shit, right? You Speaker 5 (13:17) got Speaker 2 (13:17) to. And you just got to be believable as you do it. So Speaker 8 (13:20) I'm the heiress to the Malaysian fortune of... Speaker 5 (13:23) Neurotropics. Speaker 8 (13:23) Of neurotropics. Speaker 5 (13:24) So either sometimes she lies about being connected to Malaysian royalty or high-level politicians. And basically that gives her gravitas. Then she's establishing trust with people. They think she's a player. She's also a glamorous 30-something woman with real charisma who was an entertainer. So that automatically sets her apart from the stereotypical beau mot, which is like an old man, basically. She's not your dad's beau-ma. So it all comes together and Mona is able to establish herself as a spiritual authority to the point where she begins to bottle and sell a tonic called the Light of Mona Fandie. Don't make Speaker 8 (14:05) me say it. It's her version of sweet honesty. She's like, splash it on. And you two can bathe in the light. And Speaker 1 (14:12) you can burn Speaker 8 (14:12) and burn. Oh my God. It's Speaker 5 (14:15) worse than Gina Tay. Afandi, meanwhile, starts opening martial arts studios that blend the usual practice with his and Mona's own brand of mysticism. So cult karate. I was Speaker 1 (14:28) going Speaker 5 (14:28) to say, we got cult vibes going for sure. It's at this martial arts studio that he meets a troubled young man in his early 20s named Jirai Mihusen. So Jeraime has had a very difficult upbringing. He's lived in poverty, never got an education. He's been struggling with substance abuse. But he comes to this studio looking to better himself. And Afandi decides to take him under his wing. He hires Jeraime to act as his and Mona's personal assistant. They all become very close. Speaker 4 (15:00) I'm Nancy Glass, host of the Burden of Guilt Season 3 podcast. This is a story about a horrendous situation that destroyed two families. It started more than seven years ago when Cindy and Kenny were two 40-somethings who had just gotten engaged. Days later, they walked into a scorched earth war they never saw coming. Speaker 3 (15:23) Turn around and place your hands behind your back. Speaker 6 (15:24) The cops came into my house and threw me in jail. Speaker 4 (15:26) And to Cindy's surprise, her fiancé, Kenny, was charged with abusing one of her children. Speaker 3 (15:32) I never once doubted Kenny, and I always doubted the accusation. Speaker 4 (15:38) On season three of Burden of Guilt, you'll hear a story about the lengths someone will go to in order to get what they want. Speaker 6 (15:46) This case has got to be one of the most despicable. Speaker 4 (15:49) Listen to season three of Burden of Guilt on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Speaker 6 (15:59) Welcome aboard season six of The Girlfriends, Flight or Fight, which takes place 30,000 feet in the sky. There's great food, comfortable chairs, and attentive stewardesses. The stewardesses were so beautiful. But in reality, the stewardess job is far less glamorous than it appears. Speaker 4 (16:21) It was the most sexist job I think you could have. Speaker 6 (16:29) In this era, the airlines told these stewardesses they have to be single. They had no good excuse for why they wouldn't let women be married. They have to be skinny. Speaker 1 (16:40) We were starving ourselves. Speaker 6 (16:43) And they have to be young. You would retire at age 32. But one day, a group of stewardesses said, This has got to stop. They risked it all, turning a fight for fairness into a revolution. Listen to The Girlfriends, Flight or Fight, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Speaker 5 (17:09) So now it's 1993. Mona's 37, Afandi is 36, and Jirai Me is around 23. Their BOMO martial arts venture is working out for them. They claim to be able to do things like cure impotence and help customers maintain their youth. And enough people buy into this fantasy that it provides a very comfortable lifestyle for them. So they're making good money. This is when a man named Mazlan Idris comes into the picture. Mazlan is an ambitious state assemblyman with a goal of someday being elected Pahang's chief minister. The equivalent here would like be a state legislator who's trying to become a governor. Got Speaker 1 (17:52) it. Speaker 5 (17:52) And Mazlan is reportedly introduced to Mona and Afandi through a friend. He's a wealthy guy. He's also a true believer in this kind of spiritual magic. And their services are not cheap. Speaker 1 (18:05) So Speaker 5 (18:06) he goes to them and they sell him a supposedly magical hat and cane combo that costs him 2.5 million ringgit, which when Speaker 8 (18:17) converted is worth more than a million dollars in today's money. Shut up. Yeah. Just to start spreading the news? Just Speaker 1 (18:25) to hello my baby all over the place. Do the prayers and do the stuff while he's sitting there. But once it gets into like... objects that are blessed or cursed or whatever it's like yes Speaker 2 (18:37) what are you doing well your religion shouldn't have merch should Speaker 8 (18:42) it Speaker 2 (18:42) no Speaker 8 (18:42) no Speaker 2 (18:44) i Speaker 8 (18:45) mean ours does but yeah we're not affiliated we're a cult with any and Speaker 1 (18:49) we've admitted it from the fucking beginning that's right that's our Speaker 8 (18:51) branding so they claim that this hat cane Speaker 5 (18:54) combination is going to make him invincible great so Maslan is, because he's a believer, he clearly trusts Mona and Afandi, and he wants to make this important purchase. But at the moment, his cash is tied up in several properties that he owns. So he basically pulls all the cash he can together, and then he offers them a bunch of land titles as basically collateral until he can liquidate some other things to get more cash. Don't Speaker 1 (19:23) liquidate things. He's Speaker 5 (19:25) got to for hat and cane. He could be the WB frog if he just put his mind