Rusty Egan

How To DJ

Rusty Egan reflects on four decades in British club culture, tracing his journey from a drummer experimenting with early drum machines to co-founding the legendary Blitz Club

Transcript preview

Speaker 1 (0:04) Listening Dog Media. Speaker 1 (0:12) Hello, I'm Chris Hawkins and this is How To DJ. How To DJ. Speaker 2 (0:16) DJing is a live environment, it's happening here and now. They told me the DJ was sick and what I fell Speaker 1 (0:22) in for him and I got paid 15 pounds and I was like, oh my God, like 15 pounds. Blew my mind because then you've got drum Speaker 2 (0:29) machines and you've got all these things. I know that they're machines and stuff, you know. Speaker 1 (0:33) A podcast exploring life stories, minds, experiences and techniques of much-loved DJs. We've been for this episode, one of the originals, a pioneering DJ. So I'm like here at 120 and Speaker 2 (0:47) they go, can you play Fascist Groove thing? 170 BPM and I'm going, we're Speaker 1 (0:52) here, we're here. Co-founder of the iconic Blitz Club and Camden Palace. The Blitz Club, some people have actually complimented me on it. A drummer, an electronic music architect and inventor of the new romantic scene. Speaker 2 (1:06) Co, co-inventor. You can explain in a bit. Rusty Egan, welcome to How To DJ. Thank you for having me on the show. I'm actually honoured, really, as well, because you actually know what you're talking about. Speaker 1 (1:17) Well, we'll see. And you've done a bit of research. Well, I think you're a cornerstone to what this podcast is all about. And you are one of the originals. How to DJ. You are one of the originals, aren't you? Speaker 2 (1:29) Yeah. Well, believe it or not, there is a, you can Google it, Fatboy Slim said I was inspired by Rusty Egan. He was the first. Paul Oakenfold would say the same. We're still connected with friends, so I'm not blagging. I am a drummer, and I had drum machines, and drum machines are in time. And the bottom line was, soul and funk and disco was not used in drum machines, and even I Feel Love Georgia Moroder is out of time if you put a pair of headphones on, because they only could do sequencing. They could only do that by going and then putting the delay on it. And then when you hear it in the middle break, it all goes out of time because it's not, well, these days you can quantize. There's things you can do. So today anyone can be a DJ. Yeah, anyone can press play, but can anyone find vice versa? Who are they? Well, there were a couple of blokes in Sheffield that had this little drum machine. And then they became ABC. So I found people making noises. Daniel Miller, his first ever record. And then I found Soft Cell, Depeche Mode, Spandau Ballet, put them on stage. So the point really was the timing was in the middle of punk rock. One, two, three, four. And we'd all been to every gig, seen everyone. And I go, well, I love Joy Division. And I love, you know, Killing Joke a little bit later and I love The Cult and it was like, but all the rest of it is all violence and football thugs and, you know, there was a lot of rock against racism and, you know, you loved reggae and you loved soul and ska and all that, but you couldn't go to the gig not dressed like Speaker 1 (3:27) that, not Speaker 2 (3:28) wearing, and it was all like... We don't want this anymore. We want to go back to the clubs. We were soul boys originally. We went clubbing. I even went to Pips in Manchester in 75. Only by accident. I was driving and I asked someone, is there anywhere that plays like Roxy music? Or a bloke told me they've got a Roxy room at Pips. And I've become friendly with Greg Wilson, you know. And I'm in a book, James Hamilton. Have you heard that book? Which Greg brought out. And it's even got all my playlists because he came and saw Depeche Mode at my gig, which was in a soul club. So anyway, that was a hell of a long way to say that I was a DJ drummer in Speaker 1 (4:15) 1978. What about if I take you even further back and ask, what was your perception of a DJ when you were growing up? Smashy and Speaker 2 (4:25) Nicey. Speaker 1 (4:26) Yeah, Speaker 2 (4:27) Smashy and Nicey. The kind of bloke that would wear all the free stuff given to him by the record company. So he'd have a silk jacket with wings, American tour, you know, and a briefcase metal with... tour backstage passes all over it. The kind of person who today still wears their wristbands three months after the gig or the festival, you know. So basically it was like, oh yeah, you know, I was backstage at wherever and yeah, I know him and a name dropping kind of bloke, you know. And even when they interviewed people like now, you and me interviewing each other. They literally said, and here's my mate, Rusty Egan, and we've been mates for years. And he's sitting there going, I don't even fucking know you, mate. They were like mates of stars, you know, DJs. And the bloke in the local bar was really possibly a bit like if you saw the Jimmy, Jimmy, now then, now then. If you saw the, that Manchester comedian played him. Yeah, Steve Coogan. Steve Coogan, amazing guy. He played, what was his name? Saville. Saville. And if you saw the beginning of his career, you know, all right, girls, after the show, yeah, like slimy, backstage-y, touchy-feely kind of bloke, you know. So DJs were always, for me, a little bit creepy kind of blokes. You know, hairy chest, gold medallion, long hair, looks like a rock star but isn't a rock star, knows musicians but isn't a musician. So I never, ever wanted to be a DJ. I wanted to be in a band, Speaker 1 (6:10) you know. Speaker 2 (6:11) And I was in a band. So how to be a DJ, if you went up to a DJ, even today, and asked for a request in a pub, not like, you know. not like a major gig or something. I, when people ask me when I do those pubs, I hit the tempo. So I'm like here at 120 and they go, can you play Fascist Groove thing? 170 BPM. And I'm going, we're here. We're here. Come on, sing a song. Ooh, sweet dreams of me. Come on, sing a song. What do you fucking want? And then it's like right when everyone's got their hands in the air and everyone's loving it, they're like, can you play Speaker 1 (6:52) Careless Whisper? It's our song. It's Speaker 2 (6:55) bloody midnight. So obviously you've got to program a night, haven't you? You've got to go, the last song's going to, you know, you're going to warm them up and I'm going to have them at 11.30 midnight. They're going to be, don't you want me, whatever. And then there's like this annoying person, careless whisper, our song. We were married to, oh, God, go away, you annoying person. Well, I was that annoying person to the DJ when he was playing hot chocolate and, you know, ooh, you sexy thing. And he was playing the bloke with the moustache, you know, 70s music. And I'd be going, can you play Bowie? Speaker 1 (7:36) Well. That's interesting you say that because there's a Blitz compilation with hot chocolate on it. Yeah, the reason they're on it is because the song is called Put Speaker 2 (7:45) Your Love In Me. Speaker 2 (7:48) And I used to play songs which were like a double entendre. And you were like, he was a she and she was a he. Hey, babe, take a walk on the wild side. So I'd have lyrical content like No GDM, No Great Dog Man, which is about Quentin Crisp, which was very influential. And even Andy Weatherall played that track when I was with him at the Yellow. They did an album launch at Ministry of Sound and Andy was the DJ. looked at me and dropped that track. It's sort of synonymous with the Blitz. Four to the floor, 112 BPM, massive bass line. Zoya's beheld who went on to produce fashion from Birmingham. No, so people read the sleeve notes then. You can actually do it in Spotify. Can't believe it. You can right click and go, oh, credits. I didn't know that. I only did it because... One of my songs was wrongly credited and somebody told me, one of the artists, you know, why is my name not on it? I said, what? And I had to get you to tell me. So anyway. Speaker 1 (8:53) You're big on that, aren't you? Always, I mean, the... Metadata, it's called. The backstory, the Rusty and Backstory, is very complicated and we've already gone off at tangents. We have, see? I wanted to take you back to being a kid, but anyway, but on the subject, as you've brought it up, you are very big on fairness, aren't you? Well, 100%. Speaker 2 (9:13) A hundred percent. The way I've always looked at things is the same as what I've just realized recently when Simon Le Bon said, the reason we're all together is because we're all equal. So I went on a podcast with Simple Minds, but they're not Simple Minds. It's just all the musicians who didn't get treated properly. So the guitar player and singer is like, it was all us, you know. If somebody goes dun-dun-dun, dun-dun-da-da, and then you come along and go, it's cold outside. Wow, yeah, that works. Well, you did it together. That's the way I look at it. So the guy who actually plays for Gary Newman, Chris Payne, who actually explains how he made the music of Fade to Grey with Billy Curry, he and I have written about 10 songs together. And he always comes back to me and says, I can't believe what you've done to that little bit of music. It was just an idea I had. And I said, Chris, what a great idea. It was beautiful. So it's called Collaborate. So me and Peter Hook, we've collaborated twice now. Got another mix coming out of my song with him. Boy George, even Boy George called me up and said, you know, we're 50-50. He said, yeah. He said. Can you make me less? Because I want to give a bit to my girl who sang. She was so good on it. And then I did a remix with Tony Hadley, Lonely Highway, and I got Steve Norman to play the sax from Spandau. And I said, Tony, I think we should give Steve a bit. He said, what does he want? I said, he only wants 5%. I said, give him 5%. Nobody's going to argue over 5%. And this is the point. When you get told after, you've finished. And it's in the can. And you're on to the next project, see, with me. After Visage finished, meaning was recorded, in Martin Rushen's studio, with him sitting there watching us, and suddenly it's like Midge is producing. Well, only because how many people can you fit around this desk? You know, Barry's sitting there and I'm there and Midge is where you are and the sound engineer, which is Martin Rush's guy. And we're putting together all the songs and I'm going, I want to do that and let me do that. And Barry's like, well, actually, I've got a gig. I don't need to be here because you have done me bass. You know, I'll let you know if I can fit in. He goes off with Nick Cave. John McGeach says, I've done the guitar solo on Blocks and Blocks. Let me know if you need anything else. And he says, I've got to go to Simple and Susan and Banshees. And I'm like, well, the skids want me to join them, but we're nearly finished. We're nearly finished. And we were all in other bands. That was the idea. But Midge wasn't in another band. He was in Finlizzy for a tour, making a few quid. So if he was here right now, he'd go, Rusty, Rusty, Rusty, let Speaker 1 (12:10) me explain it for you. Speaker 2 (12:13) You know, like a schoolteacher. So the point was... None of us knew. Barry Adamson got told he left. He just walked out after he got told, you ain't a writer, mate, and all that. What am I sitting in here for? I'm going off with Nick Cave. Why am I here? Rusty told me we're all equal. We're in it together. We're all equal, right? That's why I'm here. And I like the music, you know. Anyway, so the point was the manager of Thin Lizzy said, this idea of you joining Ultravox is really good. And some bloke in America, Jerry Jaffe, likes the idea and he's heard the demos that you've been doing because they've got together now. We're making bazaar and Billy and Mitt got together. And I went with them. December 1979, we all went to LA, to America, to play the Whiskey A Go-Go with me being there like shouting, mate. You know, I even played King's Lead Hat on guitar on New Year's Eve. I'm mates with Midge all the time. Nothing, we're not falling out about anything. And we're producers together. That's the way I see it. Except the manager of Ultravox, who was the manager of Phil Linnert, who became the manager of Blur, who became the manager of... I Speaker 1 (13:32) love him. It's all right now. The Speaker 2 (13:34) beloved. Love him. I mean... Speaker 1 (13:37) Proper music industry management. Speaker 2 (13:40) Midge, fucking guy on the door of a club and a DJ. Are you fucking serious? Forget it. Let me deal with them. Let me get rid of them. Well, Midge, you and me have been in the Rich Kids for two years. We've been touring and together and been roommates for the whole thing. Planning our whole... We did The Dancer together. We did it in the year 2525 together. You know, we hung out together. We're best mates. But now you've got a manager in a band called Ultravox and it's bye-bye Rusty and Steve time. And I didn't know that. I was just like a rabbit in the headlights. I'm like, if somebody told me, it's like somebody telling you your girlfriend's cheating on you. You go, what? No, no, you got the wrong person. That's the wrong person. You know, there's no way. No way. So I was literally like that. Nobody would, until you get. the finished record and all the metadata is changed. What does that mean, Rusty? Well, it means you didn't write Fade to Grey. And you go, no, I didn't write Fade to Grey. Midge