Ep. 479: Designing Homes that Evolve with Anne Hulcher Tollett

How to Decorate - Ballard Designs

In this episode of How to Decorate, host Anne Hulcher Tollett, founder of Hanover Avenue interior design firm, shares her philosophy on creating

Key takeaways

• Personal style is innate but often hidden; it can be uncovered by collecting images from various sources like magazines, social media, travel photos, or even clothing.
• Designing for evolution means creating spaces that adapt to changing lifestyles and relationships, not just current trends.

Main topics

• Discovering personal style through visual curation
• Designing homes that evolve with life changes

Notable quotes

"Everyone's got great taste. They just don't know it."

"It's our job to reveal their own personal style, not impose ours."

Conclusion

Designing a home that evolves begins not with trends or rules, but with deep listening,

Transcript preview

Speaker 3 (0:01) Welcome to How to Decorate from Ballard Designs, a weekly podcast all about the trials and triumphs of decorating and redecorating your home. I'm Caroline. I'm on the marketing team. And I'm Taryn, and I'm a product designer. I'm Liz. I head up the creative team. We're your hosts. Join the expert team at Ballard Designs for tips, tricks, and tales from interior designers, stylists, and other talents in the design world. Speaker 1 (0:22) Plus, we'll answer your decorating dilemmas at the end of each episode. We love answering your questions, so don't forget to email us at podcast at ballarddesigns.net. Now on with the show. Speaker 3 (0:33) Our guest today is Anne Pulcher-Tollett. She's the founder and principal designer of Hanover Avenue, a full-service interior design firm based in Richmond, Virginia. Her Speaker 2 (0:42) work has been featured in How's Beautiful, Veranda, Speaker 3 (0:45) The Wall Street Journal, and Architectural Digest. She's known for designing spaces that feel deeply personal, homes that honor both the architecture and the people who live in them, and that grow and change as life does. And that's exactly what we're going to talk about today, designing a home that evolves with you. Anne, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for having me, guys. Speaker 2 (1:02) I'm so excited to be here. Speaker 3 (1:03) So glad you're here today and in person, which is always a treat. I know. Speaker 2 (1:07) Well, I went to Georgia, so I had to come back. Speaker 3 (1:10) So what I loved in reviewing your portfolio is just how varied your projects are. Speaker 2 (1:17) Yeah. Speaker 3 (1:18) You know, there are some that feel a little bit more contemporary and streamlined. There are some that feel very traditional. And so it really speaks to how you get to know your clients and how you're reflecting. their own, you know, personal taste. I get bored. Speaker 2 (1:33) Yeah. I mean, we really, it's one of the, it's one of the tenants of our firm. And so I get bored really easily with, I don't want to make it look cookie cutter. I like to try to discover our own client's aesthetic. I feel like our job is to reveal their own personal style. I don't want it to look like I was there. Really like to take the time to understand what they love and how they like to live. And that's. So then, I mean, and we retire fabrics after we use them. We really try to make it look, yeah, just, oh, I want it to look just like them. I feel like they're hiring us. You don't want to put something on repeat or make it look cookie cutter. I Speaker 3 (2:08) love that. Well, you know, I think that personal style is something that if you don't know what yours is, then that's where mistakes happen, where you maybe succumb to a trend, even though it's not, it doesn't really fit who you are, or that's where you, you know, maybe you see a deal on something. And it's a great deal. So you're like, I have to do it. But it doesn't really work with your style. So getting to know your style is so important, but it's hard. Speaker 2 (2:35) Well, you know, but I think one of the things we tell clients, and sometimes they're like, I don't know what my style is, but every single person, believe it or not, has really great style. It's just trying to discover what their thumbprint is. Like, what is their fingerprint? And so sometimes people will have a harder time articulating it. And so we'll get them to just... Pull images and everyone has a different way of pulling images. Some people like to use Pinterest Some people like to use Instagram some people like to tear sheets out of magazines, but I'll just tell people to try to pull images that resonate with them. And sometimes they don't even know why they like an image. Sometimes they'll take a picture of a hotel they've stayed in or an outfit they love. And once we put all of the images up on the board and we look at it with the big screen, I'm always like, see, there you are. There you are. And so it's our job to really try to distill and see what the thread is. And then it's like, it's really fun because they can see for themselves like, yeah, I got great taste. Speaker 3 (3:33) And Speaker 2 (3:33) it's our job just to figure out how to make it look perfect and have the proportion and scale right, have it all fit together. But yeah, it's a fun job. I mean, it's like a dream. Speaker 3 (3:41) Well, but you mentioned articulating it. I think that's what people struggle with. They know what they like, but, you know, forming that into a cohesive. Speaker 3 (3:51) you know, style statement or name or something. That's hard. Speaker 2 (3:56) I like to be with clients, even our out-of-town clients. If it's on a Zoom, I like to listen to them talk. You know, like even if they don't like something, I'm like, well, tell me why you don't like it. And even if they can't explain it, but I'm pretty good at getting people to talk to me. And so we'll talk about why they do or don't like it. And then I can start to see their expressions and their little, it's like becoming really good friends with someone. But I think that's how we really get to know our clients is by listening to them talk and then showing them different ideas that we've pulled from. So sometimes they'll just give us a germ of an idea and then we'll start to build on it. But we also take a lot of time at the outset to really try to understand. We have a couple phases of design and the first one is schematic design. And that's when we're really trying to understand what is the program of the room. Like, how do you love to live? How do you love to live today? How do you love to live tomorrow? And so we're really trying to understand the bones of the room and how it needs to function. And then the rest is like, it's like figuring out what the skeleton is. Then you can put on the muscles, the nervous system, and then dress it. Speaker 2 (5:04) So it's, I mean, it's really fun, but it's like becoming friends. You know, you start to really fall in love with your clients. You start to fall in love with their house. And so it really is a process of just revealing who they are. Everyone's got great taste. They just don't know it. How would you suggest Speaker 3 (5:19) someone who maybe is working on their own project in their house? Speaker 3 (5:24) really figures out their own personal style? Because I think we're very familiar with dressing ourselves. We have a lot more practice at that than we do in a dressing room. So, you know, how do you get someone, if they don't have you, to, how do you tell them to do it themselves? Speaker 2 (5:40) I've never, I've never told someone to do it themselves because they've always hired me. But I think a great maybe trick or something to kind of prompt it for themselves would to do what, to do what we do with our clients is. Pull together many images. Sometimes you don't know why you love what you love. Put them all on a board, even if it's just like a Google Doc, and then look at it on your big screen TV. Look at it as a collage. And then suddenly you'll start to see some patterns that repeat. And then ask yourselves, you know, if you start to see something over and over and over again on social media, that is starting to become a trend. If you start to see things, I mean, once you've seen them in Target and Home Depot, it's gone, right? Like that's the end of the trend. So try to educate yourself on what you see in shelter magazines and then try to educate yourself on what you see once it gets to the big box store. But really, when you look at all of the things you love, even if it's a plate of food, an outfit, a trip, you start to see yourself. Colors reveal themselves. Profiles reveal themselves. Design movements reveal themselves. And so it might be a little harder to analyze yourself. But you could even have a friend come over and be like, do you see any common threads in what I love? And people could be like, you really like clean walls or you really love colorful kitchen islands or you seem to gravitate towards warm, moody lighting. Speaker 2 (7:13) That's how we do it. Speaker 3 (7:14) Yeah. You know, the algorithm is confusing, I think, because when you like something, you start seeing it over and over again. And then maybe you don't get exposed to things that you just haven't seen yet and maybe could work great. And so I just sometimes struggle with. Speaker 1 (7:29) Yeah. The Speaker 3 (7:30) algorithm is reflecting back to you some things that are great, but then sometimes it's not. allowing you to explore all the options. It's just like this tiny little pool of options. You Speaker 2 (7:41) can create your algorithm to be a little bit more diverse. So I would tell people to go to different shelter magazines handle. Like, look at AD, look at Elle Decor, look at Veranda, look at Flower, look at House Beautiful, go to all of them. And then also, once you start to see some of the designers that you do like from them, then go to their websites. So their Instagram or... their TikTok and start to look and see because you can start to create a disparate Speaker 3 (8:10) viewpoint Speaker 2 (8:12) for yourself. And that's where, I mean, I really think when something, when you see something over and over and over and over again, that's really when it's like everyone's just being a copycat. But if you can start to look at something and recognize that maybe you really love mid-century furniture and then you can start to look at different movements, like a great antique that goes with mid-century is like a federal piece because it's both kind of distilled. So It's just about educating your eye and try not to get stuck in the loop. Speaker 3 (8:41) What do you do when your personal style and the style of your home's architecture are at odds or maybe just you feel like they don't mesh? Speaker 2 (8:54) Well, I mean, we've had this exact moment where, and people can see it on our website, but one of our clients, the husband really loved Tudor and the wife really loved modern. They bought a really important, very historic Tudor house in Virginia. And our job was to allow him to still have his Tudor moment, but she had a very modern aesthetic. And so it's trying to take some lines that, I mean, we found some beautiful wingbacks that had been distilled. We found some beautiful profiles that echoed old Tudor architecture and kind of pared that down. So that happens a lot. And a lot of designers have kind of had to learn to navigate that with the husband and wife or the husband and husband or the wife and wife. But partners have different tastes. But the other thing to think about is, you know, a beautiful, let's say it's just a mid-century rancher. You can still have, I actually lived in a mid-century ranch in... Manhattan Beach in California, and I had some Virginia antiques. And so sometimes beautiful antiques do look good in a more streamlined setting. Sometimes really modern furniture looks fabulous in an old historic house with paneling. And we've got some of those pictures that are, I can't publish them yet because they're embargoed, but there's a lot of ways to not have to, you don't have to, if you buy a minstrel tree house, you don't have to do all Danish modern. And it's kind of like when I tell people, One good color always goes with another really good color. A really good piece of furniture always looks good. So buy the thing that already has inherently good lines. Try to find the thing that has the timeless profile and it'll go with almost anything. Speaker 3 (10:34) Yeah. Do you have, would you say you have to use a little bit of both? Like if you've, you know, in the Tudor with the modern example, you know. Bringing a little bit of both into each room to where both of them work. I mean, I like to mix it up. I don't think there are any rules. Speaker 2 (10:53) There are no rules. But I like to mix it up just so it doesn't feel quite so paint by number. So I do like to mix it up, but I really don't think there are any rules. I think the only thing that I would say is more of a tenet is really focusing on scale and proportion. Speaker 2 (11:12) I think if you can start to train your eye where, I mean, like if we're just looking at this room, for example, the seat heights are roughly the same height. There's always a place to put a drink. So it's, you know, put places to work with scale and proportion and how a human interacts with the space is more important than always focusing on mixing it up. But if you find a really great coffee table that has clean lines, that could still go with a really beautiful Victorian sofa. So it's just about it's about finding the mix and finding the things that have the right dialogue. I know that sounds so glib to just be like, just do it. But I mean, if you start to train your eye and you see examples of it and you start to learn what other people are doing, you'll start to understand what looks really good together. Yeah. Speaker 1 (11:55) Yeah. But that understanding that all the seat heights are just about the same is a really great introduction to like understanding scale. Are there other things Speaker 2 (12:05) that we need to be thinking about when we're putting rooms together? I mean, one thing I was saying, I love how y'all did it here. I mean, you just pulled this chair slightly off the wall. The sofa is pulled slightly off the wall. You have reading lights on either side of a sofa. You have a place to put a drink. I think a lot of people think that a room. Speaker 2 (12:25) doesn't fit as much furniture comfortably as it does. But lots of times we'll sit with people. And as we're trying to learn the program of the room, we're asking like, how many people need to sit in here for a holiday? What is the maximum number of people that would sit in here? What is the minimum number? Because then you don't want a room to feel all vacuous. So trying to realize that more furniture fits in a space than you really might imagine. I mean, you only need 18 inches from a Speaker 1 (12:49) coffee Speaker 2 (12:50) table to Speaker 1 (12:50) a sofa. Speaker 2 (12:51) Human beings can move around and Some people, I mean, one of my favorites, and I've studied her work forever, and she's a Virginian like I am, but Bunny Williams, I mean, if people can just pick up her books, she has a million coffee table books. She is a pro at fitting enough furniture in a room. And I think people are scared to do that. But it also changing the variety of the furniture, too. Like you can put a bench in front of a fireplace so that that could become a footstool. It could become an extra place for two booties. You know, I mean, that's just a way to get more furniture in, little occasional chairs that can be dotted around a house, can be pulled in, that could be pulled around a dining room table. So, I mean, I love just pulling something off the wall is a great first step. Speaker 3 (13:36) Yeah. I don't know really where this came from, but at some point there was this conversation that we needed to make a room look big. Speaker 2 (13:45) Right. Speaker 3 (13:45) That like, oh. I want to paint the walls white because I want it to look bigger or I need to open up the walls so it looks bigger. I don't know if that was HGTV, but I think people believe that by adding more furniture into the room, it will make the room look small and therefore bad. Right. But what you're saying is the opposite. It makes it more useful. And delicious. Speaker 2 (14:07) Yeah. Like cozy. Totally. Yeah. It really does. I mean, that's the thing. Nothing feels worse than like, hello, across the room to talk to the other person. You want the room to feel gracious. And like I've said this, I think I even have it might be on our website, but I want a room to beg you to come into it. Really comfortable furniture. And you need it to have enough furniture that you don't feel like you're just solo in the space. Right. So it really is. More furniture does not make a room feel cluttered. Often it makes it just feel very welcoming. Speaker 3 (14:39) Well, because, you know, you said 18 inches. Like you want to be able to just lean forward a little bit and put your drink down. Correct. Right. So anything more than that is uncomfortable because it's not useful because then you have to get up to or awkwardly, you know, get out of your seat. But it's also Speaker 2 (14:56) too, I mean, even like let's say over there we would want to just add, for example, if this were a proper living room, we probably could put like a lap desk or a little trunk or a chest on stand or a garden stool or something over there. And then that's another piece. That's kind of a conversation starter. It looks like you're well-traveled. It looks like you might have found a cool thing. And that's a place to plop a drink. And the other thing that we always tell people to do is to layer the lighting in a space. So you'll have often, maybe you'll have an overhead fixture, a big one. Then you might have some recessed cans that wash walls or portrait lights that are washing the walls. And then you want lamps. You might want a lamp on an arm for reading. And you would want them all to be dimmable. So that's where it's just the more you start to, for your listeners, it's really just about training your eyeballs. Just like immerse yourself in shelter magazines and coffee table books. And like I said, to make sure that you're not seeing the same thing on your algorithm, just follow the different magazines, engage with the different magazine, and then you'll start to see things that you maybe have never even thought of. And follow really cool fashion designers. And then it's another great thing to follow is, you know, luxury Instagram people that show people different resorts all around the world. Another thing, too, is let's say you're on vacation and you're on a hike, for example, or let's say you're not even on vacation. You're just walking around your neighborhood. Try to start looking at what colors and shapes are in a plant. When I was just in Arizona, I was really looking at the crazy colors that are in the cactus blooms and the cacti, like this intense chartreuse mixed with this aubergine. And then it had this like really weird persimmon like thread to it. And I was like, God, that could be a whole jumping off point. So look at how animals, how the colors of their fur comes together. Look at how animal skin mixed with the pads of your dog's feet. Like that's leather and fur. I mean, you know, so start to if you just start to see things like, oh, that's cool. That could be the whole jumping off point for some really awesome leather piping, maybe on a piece of furniture. And that's something a little more unexpected. And it just dresses up a more common profile. Speaker 3 (17:18) I also have found like tours of homes to be so instructive because then you can really see how that coffee table is 18 inch like things are pulled together. You can. you know, experience that lighting, which I think is something you don't necessarily get to see in books. So I love to, I mean, love to go into somebody's house. Speaker 2 (17:39) Even, even, I mean, it's a fun thing to do too in your neighborhood, but also you're kind of just learning what's around you, but go on open houses when things are for sale. Speaker 3 (17:47) Yeah. And Speaker 2 (17:48) then if you're going around, they'll often be, when you're traveling around, they'll have estates that are meant to be toured. And then a lot of cities have show houses or you'll have a benefit where many houses are on tour to raise awareness for one cause or another. But it really is great because the other thing is you'll start to see when designers have done it wrong. And that, I think, is the mark of when you're really like they screwed up. You can tell yourself the pillow's too big for the sofa or the proportions are really strange. You'll start to educate your eye on. what's wrong just as much as you'll educate your eye on what's right. Because Speaker 3 (18:26) it's visceral. Like you can walk into the room and be like, oh, no. Like something's off. It's like when you put your pants on and you're like, Speaker 2 (18:33) well, my pants are too tight. You Speaker 3 (18:35) can't always tell what it is necessarily, but you can know that it's like there's something off. Oh, Speaker 2 (18:39) yeah. Yeah, yeah. And Speaker 3 (18:40) on the flip side, you can tell when something's wonderful. Yes. Like you can walk in and you're just like, oh, my gosh, the vibes are just so good