#576 - Be Brilliant, Every Negative Face and 6 Music Pension Damage

Elis James and John Robins

In this episode, Elis James and John Robins discuss John's recent honorary doctorate from the Open University and his increasingly absurd li

Key takeaways

• John Robins received an honorary doctorate from the Open University, prompting jokes about his expanding list of titles like MBE and KBE.
• A Christie's auction featured 111 lots of Johnny Marr's guitars, with proceeds from 31 lots going to the Guide Dogs Trust and the Autism Society.

Main topics

• Open University Honorary Doctorate
• Johnny Marr Guitar Auction

Notable quotes

I am the right Sir Venerable Sir Lord Sir Captain Sir Dame Sir High Knight of the Garter John Robbins MBE KBE

Conclusion

A whimsical exploration of musical history and personal eccentricity t

Transcript preview

Speaker 2 (0:00) Before we start this episode, we want to invite you along to the adventures of Ellis and John. If Speaker 6 (0:04) you head over to Speaker 5 (0:04) patreon.com slash Ellis and John, you can Speaker 6 (0:07) join us on our monthly escapades, Speaker 5 (0:09) including... Speaker 6 (0:10) Mini Olympics. It's the strangest legal jump in the Speaker 5 (0:13) history of long jump. Speaker 2 (0:14) Bird watching. My two favourite things are birds Speaker 1 (0:17) and football. Retaking our driving tests. I am chock full of adrenaline. Yeah, me too. It's absolutely horrible. And you can watch our latest episode now. The Pottery Challenge. I should warn you, pottery makes me horny. We shouldn't have worn those lights, sure. Speaker 2 (0:33) So, for adventures and so much more, head over to patreon.com slash ellisonjohn now. Speaker 7 (0:41) For many of us, going further isn't a choice. It's a feeling we can't ignore. Because ambition has a way Speaker 4 (0:50) of outgrowing where it began. Turning dreams into direction. Every journey Speaker 7 (0:59) brings us closer to the life we imagine. Speaker 7 (1:04) So, where will your journey take you? Speaker 4 (1:07) Etihad. Beyond Borders. Speaker 4 (1:12) Hi, I'm Laura Widmore. And I'm Ian Sterling. And we are back for a brand new series of Murder They Wrote. The podcast that takes another look at shocking criminal cases. Historical mysteries and bizarre real-life tales. Anything else you'd like to add? Oh, I like it when people spell my name correctly. Yeah, that's not super relevant, though. No, it's not, no. Murder They Wrote with Laura Widmore and Ian Sterling. That's spelled I-A-I-N. Ian. Sorry. Listen on BBC Sounds. Speaker 2 (2:03) Oh, dear. It doesn't happen very often. Oh. It doesn't happen very often at all, but occasionally, John, because of the creative whirlpool that is his mind, he becomes distracted and he doesn't put his earphones in, so he doesn't know that the show has begun. We can say whatever we want about now. He Speaker 1 (2:22) doesn't Speaker 2 (2:22) realise that Soph has played our intro music. He hasn't checked his levels. It could be too loud. It could be too quiet. Speaker 1 (2:29) Sorry. Speaker 2 (2:31) John? Speaker 6 (2:33) Who's John? Speaker 3 (2:34) You're John, remember? Speaker 6 (2:35) Hmm. I think I'm the right Sir Venerable Sir Lord Sir Captain Sir Dame Sir High Knight of the Garter John Robbins MBE KBE of Speaker 2 (2:48) this Speaker 6 (2:48) fair kingdom. Slash Open University. Speaker 2 (2:51) I Speaker 6 (2:52) don't know if Britain means anything to you two anymore. Speaker 1 (2:55) No. Speaker 6 (2:56) What Speaker 1 (2:56) does that mean? But to some of us, it means... Look Speaker 2 (2:59) at Speaker 1 (2:59) him struggling with his mic stand. All this should have been done about a quarter of an hour ago. This guy's Speaker 3 (3:03) got an honorary doctorate. You wouldn't think that today. I'm used to having my courtiers deal with this. Yeah, Speaker 2 (3:08) he's so clever, he doesn't actually know how to use a mic stand. And he's got to get someone else to wipe his bones. He's working on his latest thesis. Speaker 6 (3:15) Well, very true, actually. And, you know, anyone who knows anything about Isaac Newton will know that he needed a great deal of day-to-day care. because he was so focused on apples, orchards, how to make cider. Speaker 2 (3:31) Oh, lashed on cider constantly. Isaac Newton's second great discovery was cider. Magnus. Gravity and cider. Yeah, that's me. That's another one of mine. Yeah, apple juice. That's another one of mine. It's all Speaker 6 (3:44) apple stuff. I did tell you that the order of service for the... the doctorate did have me listed as John Robbins MBE. Yeah, you did. Yeah, yeah. So from now, so that's now, so you know when a word is used in print, it becomes, it goes in the dictionary. Yeah. So that's now been printed by an official institution. Yeah. So it counts as an MBE because it's in common parlance. Speaker 2 (4:11) A friend of mine just decided to change his name, but he didn't go via the official channels on Deedpoll. Uh-huh. He just told everyone and then when he got a new, bank account, just put a different name in, and then kind of did it sort of by proxy. Yeah, he's going to be in a hell of a lot of trouble. Oh, yeah, yeah. He's had a terrible 20s and 30s, but it is what he did, and I suppose Speaker 1 (4:32) that's what you're doing with your MBE. I used to put Speaker 2 (4:34) Esquire on the end of my name as a joke when I was about 13. But I only grew out of Speaker 1 (4:39) that, John. Speaker 6 (4:40) I wonder if Esquire is an official term. Dave, look into it, please. Well, I got Speaker 1 (4:44) that from Bill and Ted. Yeah, I got it from Bill and Ted. Speaker 3 (4:48) Ted Theodore Logan Esquire. Celeste Preston. Is a courtesy title placed after a person's name. Its meaning depends heavily on whether you are in the United States or the United Kingdom. Kingdom, please. Okay, Kingdom is an old-fashioned, mostly unused courtesy title placed after a man's surname on official letters or envelopes when he has no other specific title. Well, that's not for me then. No, it's Speaker 5 (5:11) not for you. Speaker 3 (5:11) Because I am Speaker 6 (5:12) drowning in titles. Yeah, you're an MBE. I am an MBE, yes. So what was everyone talking about while I didn't Speaker 1 (5:20) have my headphones on? Well, we were just waiting for you. It's classic Ellis and Dave waiting on John. That's not true. That's Speaker 3 (5:28) a Speaker 1 (5:28) lie. John wants John Speaker 3 (5:30) Gates. That is true. How are your levels, John? Are they okay? Because we've not had a chance to test them. Speaker 5 (5:34) Yeah, they're good. Speaker 1 (5:34) Thank you very much, Dave. I'm pleased with my levels. Speaker 3 (5:37) Good, Speaker 2 (5:38) good. Do Speaker 1 (5:39) what I did yesterday. Go on. Speaker 6 (5:41) You hang on, Dave. Went blackberry picking? Speaker 2 (5:46) No, although I have done that. Speaker 6 (5:48) You read about the Battle of the Bulge? Speaker 2 (5:53) No, although I am reading a short history of France at the moment. I did read about Agincourt last night before bed. Speaker 1 (6:00) Absolutely Speaker 2 (6:00) battered. Speaker 6 (6:02) You Speaker 1 (6:02) burned your bum and learned a valuable lesson about grilling in the nude. No, but I'd be backing into the grill. Well, yeah, because Speaker 5 (6:11) you know what you always do? You always close the door of the oven with your bum. Speaker 1 (6:16) Oh, with my Speaker 5 (6:16) bum, yeah, yeah. But you Speaker 1 (6:17) didn't have Speaker 6 (6:17) any trousers or pants on, so Speaker 1 (6:19) you've got a Speaker 6 (6:19) big line across your bum that looks like you've been Speaker 2 (6:22) caned. Yeah, but obviously with the crevice of the bum, and it goes across that, so it looks like I'm advertising Switzerland or the Red Cross. An odd flag, wouldn't it? Yeah. It would look like I hated my country if my flag was a... Or Speaker 6 (6:39) loved my country. Yeah. Speaker 2 (6:42) It's a burnt bum on the flag. No, I went to Christie's. Speaker 5 (6:48) Ah, okay. What did you have your eye on? John Charles' boots? Speaker 2 (6:56) No, his laces. I couldn't afford the boots, so I just bought some John Charles laces. No, there was an auction of Johnny Marr's guitars. Wow. Speaker 6 (7:05) He Speaker 2 (7:05) sold all of the guitars from his past, basically, all at auction, 111 lots. The money from 31 of those lots went to charity. He's just gone. It's incredible. So the black Rickenbacker that he's associated with, that he wrote this charming man on, sold. Gone. Bang. Wallop. Bye-bye. The Gibson Cherry Red 355 that everyone... There's a famous photo of him leaning over the guitar, and in this case, he's got a fag hanging out of his mouth. Have you seen it? Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's sold. If they'd have Speaker 6 (7:37) teamed up with another musician, they could have named the auction Johnny Maran Yama. So let's do it again. Go Speaker 2 (7:44) on, Speaker 3 (7:44) I know. We all know where this is going. Speaker 1 (7:47) We'll edit all this out. Don't worry. And then you could just do your zinger. If they had teamed up with some other musicians, it Speaker 6 (7:54) could have been Johnny Marr and Har Marr Superstar and Yo-Yo Marr's Guitar Bazaar. Yeah, yeah. Speaker 2 (8:07) And they were session musicians for A-Ha. Speaker 1 (8:09) Yes. Yeah, he could have. It would have Speaker 2 (8:12) been a bit odd, wouldn't it? Well, no, because Speaker 6 (8:13) you get more lots because then you get the Yo-Yo Ma fans in. Yeah. And you get the Ha-Ma superstar. Speaker 5 (8:20) Yeah, and Speaker 2 (8:21) A-Ha's fans. And you're increasing interest in the lots. Yes. Why Speaker 3 (8:25) isn't Bruno Speaker 2 (8:26) Mars getting Speaker 3 (8:27) a look in? Get Speaker 2 (8:27) him involved, Dave! So how much was raised in the end? Rory Gallagher. Speaker 5 (8:32) Yeah, yeah, yeah. Not Rory Speaker 2 (8:34) Gallagher. No. Oh yeah, that's daft, isn't it? Sorry, I've ruined it. I Speaker 5 (8:39) met Speaker 2 (8:39) Harmar Superstar. When and how and how did I not know this and why? So they... Harmar Superstar. Yeah. And John Robbins. Yeah. When? Yeah, Odd Bedfellows. Were you drinking at the time? Yes. Okay. I think he was quite a big boozer. So Speaker 5 (8:56) we Speaker 2 (8:56) saw you at your best. Yeah. So Speaker 5 (8:58) let me get this straight. Speaker 5 (9:01) These two. Speaker 2 (9:02) I really hope it is Hamas. Speaker 3 (9:05) Because he was topless a lot, wasn't he? He tended to be topless, actually, at the time. He was topless at the time. He was on the front of, I remember, an NME cover with him on. Oh, Speaker 2 (9:13) yeah. I just, I don't know how John inhabits this world. Speaker 6 (9:17) Okay, here we go. Hamas superstar played on Cowley Road in Oxford in 2003. And here is a gig preview. Who said Wednesdays Speaker 1 (9:32) are Speaker 6 (9:32) boring? This week, the Cowley Road Place host to an entertainer who would look more at home in a seedy bar in Tijuana than in the city of the Dreaming Spires, Hamar Superstar. Did you write this? No, but I did write a review of the gig for the student newspaper. Speaker 1 (9:47) Nice. And what did you make of it? I can't remember. With John's poison pen and acid tongue. I remember asking him if he liked Frank Zappa. Oh, you interviewed him? I just met him afterwards. And did he like Frank Zappa? He wasn't Speaker 6 (10:02) particularly effusive about Frank Zappa. So who is Harmar Superstar? I don't know. Was he a sort of novelty musician? Speaker 3 (10:10) I feel like you will know more about him than we do. I mean, he's your best friend, John. He kind of had a three-month period where he was the future of rock and roll somehow. Really? In Speaker 2 (10:19) the Speaker 3 (10:19) time of Speaker 2 (10:20) Andrew WK. He was very hairy as well, from what I remember. Was he? Andrew WK, the NME said he was the future of music, which is such a big claim. And they loved the one single he made so much that they put him on the cover twice. It's a great track. And Speaker 1 (10:36) there Speaker 2 (10:36) were two covers to that edition, that sort of week's edition. Speaker 1 (10:42) He's not been doing much recently. Has he not? No. Well, let's get him on the show. Imagine if we could reboot his career. Speaker 3 (10:50) Is this? No, not. Speaker 6 (10:52) Oh. Don't scroll down too far the Wikipedia page or you'll get your answers. Okay, Speaker 3 (10:58) cool. Well, we didn't Speaker 6 (10:58) pin our colours to... Is Speaker 2 (11:01) there a controversy section? Speaker 1 (11:02) Yeah, just sexual assault accusations. Oh. We leave it there, don't we? We leave it there. Yes, we do. And we... And I'm glad I didn't. I like him. Yeah. I Speaker 5 (11:16) think I knew. Speaker 1 (11:18) I'm glad you give him such a rotten Speaker 2 (11:20) review now. I could probably find the review, actually. Because he didn't sound like the four bands you like. Speaker 5 (11:24) Oh, dear. Speaker 6 (11:28) It's a shame. Well, it is a shame. I mean, it's not a shame that... No. It's a shame that people behave like that, allegedly. Speaker 2 (11:36) Well, back to My Musical Icon. There was an exhibition of all of his guitars so the general public could go and see them. Speaker 3 (11:43) And that Speaker 2 (11:43) had been running for about a week at Christie's. But because of work, and I went back to Wales to visit my parents, the only time I could go was about an hour before the exhibition finished, before the auction began. So I was there at one o'clock just looking at all these guitars that I've seen in the NME and in magazines and in interviews for the last 35 years. So I assumed they'd chuck us all out, but they didn't. Because suddenly they were removing guitars from the wall. And I was like, oh, they're bound to jerk us out in a second. Because all, what was funny was full of sort of indie music fans who just wanted to see them. And then the serious guitar buyers who were about to spend, you know, 358 grand on a Rickenbacker. Could you distinguish between the two crowds? A little bit, yeah. It was quite sweet. I met a few people who were like... Oh, maybe people run out of money by the end. Hang on. So you went to the exhibition. Did you go to the auction? Well, so I assumed they'd chuck us out before the auction began, but they didn't. So I just stayed and watched the auction. Did you get your wallet out? I didn't get my wallet out. Oh, come on. That must have been like a guitar pick. Speaker 3 (12:47) You had to Speaker 2 (12:48) register beforehand. Oh my God. And also the one... This Speaker 6 (12:52) is, you know... Famous musician auction 101. Yeah. You've got to register. Speaker 2 (12:57) The one I really liked did go for, I think, for £104,000. What was it? It was an Epiphone Casino, the one that he does the rhythm part for How Soon Is Now on. Speaker 1 (13:07) But are there any clothes? No, posters, Speaker 2 (13:10) gig posters. What about one of those? Speaker 2 (13:13) I just, no, I just wanted, I should have bought a gig pot, although they went for a lot of money as well. There was a lot of amps. Yeah. Quite a few acoustic guitars, guitars that he'd either bought or been given by John Entwistle. It was, but I'd never seen an auction before. Well, that's not actually true. My aunt used to take me to livestock markets. something to do when I was Speaker 1 (13:35) a Speaker 2 (13:35) teenager. Of course. So I remember my auntie Elsie took me to Carmarthen Mart, me and my little sister. So were Speaker 6 (13:41) you expecting people to go up to the... But were you expecting people to go up to the guitars and like slap them Speaker 1 (13:47) and sort of stroke them? Yeah, with loads of Speaker 2 (13:49) iodine on their hands. Yeah. I remember going to Carmarthen Mart to watch a livestock auction. And with my little sister, she was about five. My auntie Elsie said, don't blow your nose or you'll end up buying some lambs. That's true. I did Speaker 6 (14:04) once accidentally buy the wrong coins at a coin auction. Oh, no. Yeah, Speaker 1 (14:09) I got confused Speaker 6 (14:10) about the numbering and the... Speaker 1 (14:11) So what Speaker 6 (14:12) did you end up with? Some fake pennies. Oh. It was like a lot of fake pennies. They were listed as that and it was before the farthings that Speaker 3 (14:24) I wanted to bid Speaker 1 (14:25) for. Oh, no. Speaker 3 (14:26) I've Speaker 1 (14:26) been Speaker 3 (14:26) to a secondhand used car auction. Have you? They fly through cars. But what's funny is that me and my dad went with my mate and his dad. And his dad, who's an old head teacher, but just one of the nicest guys in the world. So just like a really, really agreeable guy and like, you know, we'll just get on with anyone. So every time the... What would you call the person that's doing the auction? Auctioneer. Auctioneer, of course. Every time they glanced at Dave, his dad, he's like nodding back at him because he's too polite to not kind of engage with whoever's looking at him. So my dad had to nudge him and go, you realise you're putting bids in here without realising because he kind of smiles and nods back because this guy's looking at him like that with his hands out. Oh, that's Speaker 2 (15:04) fantastic. It was the same thing with my little sister and the lambs. Yeah. She didn't want to buy two calves or whatever it was. I Speaker 6 (15:12) also went to an auction, a coin auction, or an antiques auction with a coin section in Bristol that was being filmed for Bargain Hunt. Oh, Speaker 3 (15:21) nice. Speaker 6 (15:21) So Tim Wonnicott was there. Oh, yeah. Chatting to a sort of retired couple who were about to make a £10 loss on a plate. Yeah. And that would go out on the BBC. Speaker 6 (15:34) But that was quite fun. I bought a sovereign. Speaker 5 (15:37) Did Speaker 3 (15:37) you? Ring? Speaker 5 (15:39) No, just Speaker 2 (15:40) a sovereign. Tough guy. You're a bouncer. So you didn't buy anything. No, it was really interesting though, because I'd never seen an auction before other than for livestock. And they don't say going once, going twice, which I'd been led to believe they did on sort of TV dramas and things. But it was so, yeah, when they brought the 355 out, which was my, is still my dream guitar, but obviously, you know, I'm not going to spend 20 grand. Speaker 2 (16:09) They were like, okay, there's an awful lot of interest in this bit. It's an iconic guitar that Johnny Marr wrote Heaven Knows I'm Miserable Now and Girl Afraid in the same afternoon on it. We've got £40,000 in the room, £50,000 in the room, £60,000 on the phone. Oh, someone from Florida's entered. Thank you very much. £70,000. Someone from Paris, Mercy Buku, £80,000. Let's go up in fives. £105, £110. When were they put in the house? How did they know? There Speaker 3 (16:34) were Speaker 2 (16:34) people on the phones. There were people online. Speaker 3 (16:36) Yeah, but in the room, what was the signal that someone was wanting to be? Oh, Speaker 2 (16:40) you Speaker 1 (16:40) had to register, so you had a little sort of, you got given a card and putting that up. I can do an impression of how the phone people work, Dave. Yes. They go like this. Speaker 2 (16:50) Yeah, that's... Yes, that's exactly it. Now do we... We're an audio medium. We are an audio medium. Speaker 6 (16:56) So they say to the person on the phone, the bid's gone up to 160,000, the next bid will be 165. They wait, they pause the response, they put their hand over the receiver and they nod. Or they go out. Speaker 2 (17:09) Yeah, and also on the phones they had much longer to discuss it than I realised. I thought you were to make very quick decisions. I thought you were to go in... with a figure in mind, and then that was that. But for, I think, the Rickenbacker, the lady was on the phone, and she turned her back and was on the phone for probably, it felt like about a minute, and then the auctioneer said, I love seeing people's backs. A big laugh. Very much like a sort of compare. There was a lot Speaker 3 (17:37) of stuff going on in the room. Well, maybe that's future adventures at getting YouTube being auctioneers for the day. I think you're doing it with a real Speaker 2 (17:44) glint in the eye. I was thinking this. John, I think, would be a great auctioneer. I think I would mess it up. But there was a bit of emceeing. Speaker 6 (17:52) Well, there's lots of charity auctions knocking around, Dave. You know, sell a wine tasting in Provence for £1,200 to a corporate CEO so he can feel better about himself. but also gets a wine tasting out of it. I Speaker 2 (18:07) think, John, I was watching The Lady at Christie's and I did think, I actually think if comedy goes wrong for John and he has a complete personality change, I think you'd be a good auctioneer at The Lady at Christie's. I Speaker 5 (18:20) think I could be quite persuasive. The bid is with you, sir. Two and a half thousand pounds. Do I see 2,700? Sir? If you don't bid 2,700, I will soil myself. Do you want that on your conscience? Well, look at all these people having a lovely day. Do you want it ruined by me soiling myself? 2,700. Speaker 2 (18:45) Come Speaker 5 (18:45) on! Speaker 5 (18:48) I can't imagine that at Christie's. No, that would be at a charity auction. Oh, right. Not at Speaker 3 (18:53) Christie's or Sotheby's or any of the other big ones. But it's not up to you, the auctioneer, to be persuading people to go up in price, is it? I think Speaker 6 (18:59) it Speaker 3 (18:59) is at a charity auction. Oh, Speaker 2 (19:00) is it? Right. Yeah, Speaker 1 (19:01) at a charity auction. At a Speaker 2 (19:02) charity auction, you are trying to get as much money out of people as possible. And so you are trying to be persuasive. Oh, yeah. No, yeah. But yeah, it was lovely. It was lots of listeners to this show at the exhibition. Really? Were there? Yeah, so I met... It's been a big, big old deal. Speaker 5 (19:17) I've not seen anything about it. Yeah, that's Speaker 2 (19:19) really strange. That's all my algorithm has fed me for about a week. This is the problem. I thought the world was talking about this. Six Music were. Speaker 6 (19:26) This is why stand-up comedy is so hard now. Not that I do it that much. There's no monoculture. No. You can't talk about stuff that's in the public eye because it's, unless it's like something huge and horrific. Yeah. You could not do stand-up about an advert anymore. Speaker 2 (19:45) No, no, no, no. That's a good observation. You can't do Speaker 6 (19:48) stand-up about a TV programme. No. Really? You