WTF India: Are We Losing the Plot? | Dostcast Live 02 w/ Suhel Seth

Dostcast

Suhel Seth joins Dostcast Live to discuss his new book, "What the Fuck India? Are we losing the plot?", critiquing systemic failures in urban infrastructure, civic

Key takeaways

• Suhel Seth argues that "jugaad" is not innovation but a culturally accepted bypass that undermines scientific problem-solving and systemic improvement.
• Infrastructure failures like monsoon flooding, leaking buildings, and toxic AQI are framed as symptoms of a broader culture of mediocrity and political apathy rather than isolated incidents.

Main topics

• Civic apathy and the "chalta hai" mindset
• Infrastructure decay and systemic corruption

Notable quotes

"If you use the word jugad, more often than not, it is to suggest that, yaar, main jugad kar loonga."

Conclusion

The episode serves as both a sharp critique of India's institutional a

Transcript preview

Speaker 1 (0:02) you Speaker 1 (0:07) Thank you so much for coming to the second edition of Dostka's Live. Speaker 1 (0:12) This is the first time I'm doing it in Delhi. Last time I did the live podcast with India's most famous adult star. That is not the nature of today's conversation. Before I begin, I want to ask you a bunch of questions. Honestly, how many people here have given a bribe in their lives? Speaker 1 (0:33) How many people have screwed and cursed the government in their head whenever their car hits a pothole? Speaker 1 (0:42) How many people here absolutely hate the air in Delhi? Speaker 1 (0:48) How many people are saving but unfortunately are unable to go abroad to escape the urban nightmare that is India? Speaker 1 (0:56) Mixed reactions. The same questions also plague me. But for some reason or the other, every winter, there is terrible AQI. The roads are bad. Recently, we saw what happened in Gurgaon NCR. And we do nothing. In India, we have a culture of mediocrity, a culture of koi baat nahi chalta hai, a culture of humaara desh mahaan hai. We're simply here to discuss Suhail Seth's new book, What the Fuck India? Are we losing the plot, right? I'm sure many of you know about Suhail Seth. You've seen him as the man in the suits with other men in suits, as the man who's been with Ratan Tata, Prince Charles, you name it. Suhail is always photographed with the best, the most elite, right? So when he wrote this book, I was kind of surprised. Suhail, you're already so rich. You're now middle class. Why do you care about what is happening in urban India, right? This is clearly not, at least our politicians have declared, this is clearly not an enough problem to vote for. But his book came out. And when I read the book, I was surprised because... In one way or the other, the book labels everything that we find wrong in India, but don't talk about. We all retweet our politicians. We all complain about the AQI. But year after year, there is no change. So I figured, you know what, let's just have the conversation with other urban folk like myself in a place which is, you know, famously, I've been told Dhanmel is a place where lots of designer stores are there. Even after being so rich, you can't escape bad air and bad roads. Speaker 1 (2:34) On that note, I want to invite on stage Suhail Seth. Good evening. Suhail, I want to ask you today, you've written your book, What the Fuck India? Are we losing the plot, right? No, it's WTF. Speaker 1 (2:48) F stands for fish, Speaker 2 (2:49) since Speaker 1 (2:50) our streets are flooded. Well, something from the book that really stood out to me was the phrase, Chalta Hai, right? I've been hearing this since I was a kid. The other phrase that I heard was Jugar, right? In your book, you said you should absolutely eliminate this word from the Indian vocabulary. What led you to this? Many years ago, It Speaker 2 (3:12) was Anand Mahendra who used the word Jugaad in a glorification of some innovation. Basically, it was a piecemeal kind of thing that someone had done in Bombay. It wasn't an innovation. Speaker 2 (3:30) There was no science behind it. It's the kind of jugaar that electricians do when they want to steal electricity from someone else's house and they stick a wire to your house. And at that point in time, and Anand was... He's a friend, but he was also a client. And I wrote saying that this is terrible because you are legitimizing something that's a byword for a bypass. It's not real. It's not mired in science. It has no logic. And it's almost suggesting that it's the easy way out. In our parlance, if you use the word jugad, more often than not, it is to suggest that, yaar, main jugad kar loonga. You know, I'll manage. So there are actually three words. In India, there are beautiful. Aap manage kar lena. Bhi kya manage karo? Speaker 2 (4:30) If your streets are flooded, they'll say, manage karlo. Short of being electrocuted, how else do you manage this? Second is Chalta Hai. And third, obviously, is Jugaaar. The biggest phrase that all of us must be scared of is when anyone in our country tells you Don't worry. When they tell you don't worry, you should be the most worried. Because what's going to follow is going to be an avalanche of destruction. But we have... This is part of our vocabulary. This is a justification of the mess that India is in. A mess that hasn't been caused by this government or that government. It's been there since 1947. The British created the sewage system. Mohenjo-Daro and Harappa were fine. Our palaces were air-cooled, fine. We had the Angan in the middle for, you know, ventilation, community building. All of that's existed. Now, our airports, even before a flight takes off, they're leaking. Parliament is leaking. Old parliament is not leaking. The new building is leaking. So obviously someone is screwing up. The Bombay Pune tunnel recently had a waterfall that would put the Niagara to shame. When was it built? 6 months ago. Speaker 2 (6:03) These jokers, Naib Singh Saini and his ilk, including Rekha Gupta, who's equally bad. I mean, for 4000 years, we've had the monsoon. It's not as if it's a surprise that, oh, this year it will rain. We're not in sub-Saharan Africa. They don't prepare. And we get used to it. Mainstream media will cover it between July and September. Then they'll move to AQI. By March, it'll be the budget and then whatever else the hell happens. So we even have new cycles when the coverage will happen. Where does the citizen go? There is no follow-up. And people will say, they don't even say Magnolia, they say Mongolia. Actually, I have no chinta. Speaker 2 (6:57) I haven't yet been electrocuted. I mean, otherwise you won't see me. I haven't ever been, I have never been stuck in flooded waters. I've seen cars being stuck. So actually, I'm not bothered in a technical sense. I haven't been affected personally. Speaker 2 (7:14) But every citizen is affected. The book says very clearly, if you look at air pollution, all of us can afford air purifiers. At PM 2.5, it is fatal. Your lungs are on the verge of collapse if you're born in Delhi, Oblique Gurgaon. Speaker 2 (7:37) What do you do? Speaker 2 (7:39) So if you live in, I was about to say Mongolia, if you live in Magnolias and all those areas, they're like urban ghettos. So if KP Singh can get the underpass on that golf course road, right? Why can't our PWD jokers get it right? And then we say, oh, we have great engineers. Speaker 2 (8:04) Doesn't work. So obviously there is a systemic defect. And there is no obtuse, opaque thing called the system. We are the system. We make the system. We elect these jokers year after year. Technically, ML Khattar and Nabsingh Saini should not have been elected, but they are. Because the people in Gurugram don't go and vote. They're either getting drunk or falling into manholes. Speaker 2 (8:33) Gurgaon has more liquor vents than traffic lights. Speaker 2 (8:39) And it's not a bad thing because if you're totally drunk, you're oblivious to what's happening in the country. If you want to drink at 7 pm and we are hungover the next day, you have passed the monsoon test. Because you're so bloody wet that it doesn't really matter if there's a rainfall, if there's a storm, nothing. Hurricane won't bother you. It's another matter that you might die because you've just consumed spurious liquor. But then, you know, your wife and all will have to suffer. That's if they really have to suffer. Many of them would be relieved. Speaker 2 (9:17) So it's that kind of thing. You know, it actually it is a laughable situation. It is so funny and yet so painful and ironic. Speaker 2 (9:31) There's a lovely book many, many years ago, written by Mark Tully, who sadly we lost, called No Full Stops in India, where he uses one line, which is very important. He says, whatever you see of India, the opposite is equally true. Aar dekho, night before last, so I just got in from Calcutta. I was at a dinner at Taj Bengal in a fine dining restaurant. Speaker 2 (9:58) And there was a table. of good Marwadi people. Sweet chaps. One joker was hearing Pooch Puri songs. at a volume that would defy any decibels that are allowed in, you know, public life. Speaker 1 (10:18) So I told him, I said, you don't have any civic sense. And Speaker 2 (10:22) he? I said, civic sense, Nia? Speaker 2 (10:26) civics? But I said, no, no. And then I used, man, just civic sense, civic sense. I said, Speaker 2 (10:36) Someone else can do it, but nothing like this has been done. Speaker 2 (10:41) What do you do? Get onto a plane? Same thing. The other beauty about India is get into an aircraft and land. Every bugger is running. Speaker 2 (10:58) And if you're waiting, people look at you as if you're an invalid waiting for a wheelchair. No, but I'm just waiting for this goddamn crowd to get over. So there are some fundamental issues. But the same jokers, when they go abroad, they're very well behaved. Because there's penalty, there's shame. And, you know, but now even that has been, now you'll have thepla dance, lungi dance, all that shit happening at airports across Speaker 1 (11:22) the world. So that's how it is. Let's talk about the systemic issues, right? In your book, you talk about the air. You have also tweeted several times at Nayab Singh Senian. Some work has been done, more or less. Yeah, he sent the additional chief secretary to camp in Speaker 2 (11:40) Gurgaon for six days. And I was after their ass every day. Every day. This year in March, a guy called Uttam Singh messaged me. Speaker 2 (11:52) Myself, Uttam Singh. When they use this kind of grammar, you know they are from Haryana. So I said, yes, question mark. I'm the new district commissioner. I said, good. Seeking Blessing I said, go to Neem Karoli. What the fuck am I supposed to do? Seeking blessing. So my wife tells me he's buying insurance. I said, means? So that you don't abuse him when the monsoons happen. But predictably, I have. Speaker 2 (12:24) I'll be here yet. Speaker 2 (12:27) But people don't want to fight these bastards. They don't. The reason why they don't want to fight them is they're always worried. And here I have something I will give you. I mean, I'll relate an anecdote. I will not tell you which channel. Speaker 2 (12:45) Many years ago, before many of you were born, Rupert Murdoch. wanted to get in the news business and he wanted to start Star News. But there were already news channels. There was NDTV. There were two, three other channels. There was Shuklaji's channel also. And they created a whole movement. Speaker 2 (13:08) So at that time, the head was Peter Mukherjee. And he says, will you take a stake? I said, I don't have any money. He says, we'll get you a bank loan. I said, one minute, one minute. You guys will disappear. I'll be stuck with the loan. He says, no, we'll underwrite the loan. Cut a long story short. It's all in the public domain. I became a 42 % shareholder, the largest shareholder of Star News. Speaker 2 (13:30) And it was good bragging when I could tell people, Murdoch is my partner. You couldn't be bothered. Speaker 2 (13:37) There's a program on television and Jaswant Singh was my briefing client when I handled Vajpayee's campaign in 1999. Speaker 2 (13:46) Jaswant is a finance minister. But Jaswant was also lobbied. by all these Indian news channels. They will ruin it. They'll be objective. They'll be honest. We don't want that. So just one thing in his usual very fake English accent told me says You know, we're investigating you. Speaker 2 (14:11) And we will be looking at all your Speaker 1 (14:13) tax records. Speaker 2 (14:15) I said, see, the thing, Jaswant, is I even buy my condoms on a credit card. I don't know when you used the former. Speaker 2 (14:23) Joke. Today, if you said you'll be, the ED will be after you. But If you even have an iota. Speaker 2 (14:35) of incorrectness in your life, they will go after you. Having said that... All the people who say it's vindictive, vindictive, vindictive, nothing has happened. There are enough people in this country. I'm only a menace. There are zillions of people in the country who are courageous, who are brave, who've taken the pass on. Speaker 1 (14:56) See. The thing with number is if I Speaker 2 (15:00) have a political agenda, then they will screw you. Speaker 2 (15:05) But if you don't have a political agenda, they won't. Because even they know that you're doing it. What was my... How did this whole book actually begin? In July, there was an Indian Express adda at the Taj Mahal Singh. The two speakers were Vinay Saxena, who was the then LG of Delhi, and Amitabh Kant. Speaker 1 (15:23) I was not Speaker 2 (15:27) even supposed to speak. In those days, I used to drink alcohol. I was already on my fourth tequila or something. One of the ladies from Express said, will you ask a question? I said, I have no questions to ask. Speaker 2 (15:39) I said, but I will make a comment. And I got up, which is why tequila is very helpful. And I said, it's a shame what you people have done to Gurugram. It's an absolute shame. On the one hand, you talk about smart cities. It's run by the most unsmart people. The prime minister talks about brand India. It's a shame. If 71 of India's top 100 companies are housed in Gurugram, can you imagine what the Coca-Cola CEO will be telling Atlanta? Can we have a meeting tonight? No, one of our people has just died, electrocuted because of floodwaters. What does it say about your brand? Speaker 2 (16:22) Every monsoon, the New York Times puts us on the front page. Every monsoon. These people don't realize the collateral damage they are causing and the dominoes effect that it has on brand India. Speaker 1 (16:39) And that's what I said. Speaker 2 (16:42) And that went viral. But the beauty about this country is then I started getting messages. One guy wrote to me from Muzaffarpur saying, One guy, Pinakian Patel, the architect, wrote to me from Alibaug. Speaker 2 (17:03) I am not a crusader. A, B, and I'm too lazy to go to, you know, Redford, Jantar Mantar. I mean, even Dunmills is a trudge. Speaker 1 (17:14) I'll be honest with you. I'm, you know, Speaker 2 (17:17) I'm not meant for protests. Speaker 2 (17:21) What I can do, and I've always done on Twitter, I've done three things on Twitter. One is I've always retweeted. The need for blood. So whenever a blood bank asks for a particular type of blood, I always read it. I did a lot of work during the COVID using Twitter, using other platforms to make sure people got oxygenators, respirators, all of that. And then obviously, I've been running a tirade against these johnnies for years. What happened at the express event was that it suddenly went viral. Speaker 2 (17:56) But the issue is not that. And now you know what they're telling us? This year 30 % less flooding. Who's going to bloody calculate how much flooding there was? Okay, this time 30 % is less. Speaker 2 (18:08) That's how they change the narrative. and each one of us is responsible because we allow them to get away. KP Singh of DLF, who I have a lot of respect for. In an interview to Shekhar Gupta, Walk the Talk, many years ago, when Shekhar said, have you ever bribed anyone? Speaker 2 (18:29) No. Speaker 2 (18:32) Speed money, yes. Speaker 2 (18:37) Shekhar asked for speed money to get the job done quickly within policy. Speaker 1 (18:44) You try and understand that. If Einstein were alive, there'd be no E is equal Speaker 2 (18:47) to MC squared. He'd be screwed in the head. What does this mean? A bribe is a bribe, period. Speaker 2 (18:56) In the book, I've talked about and this happened with my own mother. And you know, we know, everyone knows people. When my mother passed, it was a nightmare getting her death certificate, which I mentioned in the book. And I've even said it was poignantly captured by Mahesh Bhatt in Janam, if any of you remember that film. Speaker 2 (19:15) What kind of a country are you if getting a death certificate also requires a bribe? That should tell you about