Showdown in mom's murder trial. Verdict in Microsoft employee murder. Plus, what is postpartum psychosis?

Dateline NBC

This episode of Dateline True Crime Weekly covers multiple high-profile murder trials and mental health issues. In Massachusetts, the trial of Lindsay Clancy, a former labor and delivery nurse accused of killing her children, reaches its climax with

Key takeaways

• Postpartum psychosis is more common than often believed, with potentially thousands of cases annually, yet remains underreported due to stigma.
• The prosecution's expert witnesses in the Clancy trial contradicted each other on diagnoses but agreed that Lindsay knew her actions were wrong.

Main topics

• Lindsay Clancy murder trial
• Postpartum psychosis

Notable quotes

I tried to kill myself.

Conclusion

The episode underscores the complex intersection of mental health, criminal responsibility, and societal stigma. While legal

Transcript preview

Speaker 5 (0:00) I really love the Start Today app. They Speaker 6 (0:02) care about how I feel. Speaker 5 (0:04) It's the staff on the app. It's the connections you make. Speaker 6 (0:08) Without good mental and physical health, you have nothing. Speaker 1 (0:12) It tells me how to cook to keep myself healthy. Speaker 6 (0:17) I look at my app and I'm like, wow, I didn't know I did 7,000 steps today. Start Today meets you where you are. Download the Start Today Wellness app now on your Apple or Android device. Terms apply. See app for details. Speaker 6 (0:30) Hi, I'm Kate Snow, NBC News anchor and host of the NBC News podcast, The Drink. This month, I'm sitting down with actor, writer, producer, Brendan Hunt. Most of you know him as Coach Beard from Ted Lasso, but there is so much more to his story. We sit down, we talk about all of it, from his bumpy upbringing to his years in improv comedy and how a Hollywood rejection opened the door to co-creating Ted Lasso. It's an open, funny conversation about perseverance, creativity. and the winding road that brought him right here. We hope you'll join us for the drink. Listen and follow wherever you Speaker 1 (1:05) get your podcasts. Speaker 6 (1:09) I hope everybody's having a good morning. Speaker 1 (1:11) You're listening in to the Dateline Morning Meeting. Speaker 8 (1:14) They have dropped the case on basically the eve of trial. Our Speaker 1 (1:18) producers are catching up on breaking crime news. It's all over social media. Speaker 2 (1:23) The DA is joining in on the investigation as well. Speaker 1 (1:27) Welcome to Dateline True Crime Weekly. I'm Andrea Canning. It's August 27th, and here's what's on our docket. In Florida, a verdict has been reached in the trial of the man accused of hiring a hitman to murder father of four and Microsoft employee Jared Bridegan. In the defense, please rise and hearken to the jury's verdict. In Dateline Roundup, we'll check in on the trial of Keefie D. Davis, the former gang leader accused of masterminding the murder of rap legend Tupac Shakur. And Donna Adelson, the Florida grandmother convicted of murdering her former son-in-law, FSU law professor Dan Markell is demanding a new trial. Speaker 4 (2:06) According to the appeal, Donna was repeatedly warned by the judge to not show emotions during the trial. Speaker 1 (2:11) Plus, postpartum psychosis. We've been hearing a lot about it at the murder trial of former labor and delivery nurse Lindsay Clancy. But what exactly is it? At some point, you may start to lose touch with reality. But before all that, we're in Massachusetts, where the Clancy trial is winding down. but not without some legal fireworks in the courtroom. For the past five weeks, we've watched Lindsay Clancy stand trial for the murders of her children. Dozens of witnesses have talked about what might have driven her to kill them. Prosecutors say it was planned, the act of a woman who didn't want to be a mother anymore. The defense says she was not in her right mind. She was overmedicated and suffering from undiagnosed postpartum psychosis. Now, in the final days of the trial, the prosecution has done its best to undermine that theory with three rebuttal witnesses who spent hours evaluating Lindsay Clancy. Here to tell us what they had to say is Nate Eaton of East Idaho News and the host of the podcast, Courtroom Insider. Nate, welcome back. Thanks for having me. Good to be here. Yeah. So, Nate, as the trial winds down, fair to say this has been maybe the most contentious week of testimony we've seen yet? Speaker 3 (3:26) For sure. You know, this is the final stretch, and the defense really has to nail its arguments home while the prosecution has to land their case. It's a battle of the experts. That's what we're seeing play out in court. Which expert is right? Speaker 1 (3:41) Nate, before we get into their testimony, we should warn listeners that some of what we're going to be talking about is distressing and includes discussion of suicide. So the first rebuttal witness the prosecution called was Dr. Avram Mack, a forensic psychiatrist who met with Lindsay in April of this year. Nate, what did he have to say? Speaker 3 (3:59) Well, he evaluated Lindsay over the course of two days. He observed her behavior and went through her medical records from immediately before and after the deaths, and he reached this diagnosis for her. Her description of her experience, in my view, that, sorry, matched. a major depressive episode. Speaker 1 (4:19) Did he explain what that meant? Speaker 3 (4:22) Well, he said that the diagnosis means that an individual displays problems with their mood, experiences guilt or worthlessness, can't sleep, and has a preoccupation with death or suicide. These were all things that Lindsay suffered from, according to the doctor and other doctors who have testified. But Dr. Mack made it clear that he did not. believe Lindsay was suffering from psychosis or was overmedicated. He also said that she was very aware that killing her children was wrong. So Speaker 7 (4:54) this is a complete rejection of the defense's theory. How did the defense handle this expert on cross-examination? Speaker 3 (5:04) Kevin Reddington, Lindsay's attorney, really questioned Dr. Mack's experience. He was quick to point out that during his direct testimony, the doctor incorrectly described what an episiotomy is. That's a medical term for a surgical incision used during childbirth. The doctor referred to it as a tear. Speaker 6 (5:24) Did somebody tell you that you were way off base on that testimony Friday, sir? Speaker 5 (5:30) I'm not sure what you're referring to. Speaker 6 (5:32) I'm referring to you saying that an episiotomy is a tear. And it's not. Speaker 8 (5:38) And, Your Honor, is there a question before the witness? Speaker 6 (5:40) I already asked the question. I'm looking at him staring back at me. Speaker 7 (5:43) So Dr. Mack is a forensic psychiatrist. I'm just curious, do we know why they were even asking Speaker 1 (5:49) him about episiotomies? You know, that's something in the delivery room. I'm sure he probably learned about it in med school, but that was probably a long time ago. Speaker 3 (5:59) That's right, Andrea. And that may actually be Reddington's point. that he's arguing a psychiatrist meeting with Lindsay, weighing in on her mental health after having a baby, should have the expertise dealing with patients who have given birth or experienced postpartum. Now, Reddington made a huge point to the jurors when he went through Dr. Mack's resume that he really didn't have the experience. Speaker 6 (6:24) Where in here does it say that you ever came within breathing distance of a pregnant woman and you're... practice in your interest in your writings. Speaker 3 (6:34) Dr. Mack responded that he did have experience with pregnant women, saying he had treated around 10 patients who experienced postpartum psychosis since 2001. Speaker 7 (6:45) So the prosecution not only had Dr. Mack evaluate Lindsay, but they also had another Speaker 1 (6:52) expert who happened to be their second rebuttal witness, a forensic psychologist named Dr. Kirk Halbrin. They did. And Andrea, Speaker 3 (6:59) the new doctor, Dr. Halbrin, said that Lindsay experienced bipolar II disorder. So a different diagnosis than Dr. Mack. And this is just indicative, perhaps, of how subjective all of this is. Even the prosecution experts can't agree. But one thing they did agree on is that Lindsay knew what was right. and what was wrong when she killed her children. And because of that, she should be criminally responsible. What's he basing that on? Well, remember how Patrick, her then-husband, went out to pick up some food and visit the CVS? Dr. Halbrin talked about the moment Patrick returned home. He found Lindsay on the ground outside of that second-story window. She was semi-conscious after she had jumped from that window following the killings of her children. This expert said something Lindsay told Patrick at that moment was inconsistent with psychosis. He Speaker 8 (7:54) said his first question was, what did you do? And her response was, I tried to kill myself. Speaker 3 (8:01) He went on to testify that someone experiencing hallucinations would have instead said something like this. I did what I had to do. Speaker 8 (8:09) I did what the voice said, or something like Speaker 3 (8:12) that. Speaker 1 (8:13) Nate, the doctor then went on to talk about something that brought the trial to a screeching halt. Tell us about that. Speaker 3 (8:19) Yeah, Dr. Halbern's testimony veered into a topic that shouldn't be brought up in court, and that's religion. Speaker 8 (8:26) One of the things that she said when asked about what happened is that in the course of strangling each child, she said, go to God, baby, go to God. She was raised as a Catholic, and this... As I understand Catholic considerations, that's not necessarily what happens. But when I asked her about that, when I said, isn't suicide a mortal sin? Yeah, can I see counsel over here? Speaker 3 (9:01) Now, the jurors were sent out of the courtroom and the defense immediately filed a motion for a mistrial, claiming intentional misconduct