Would You Rather: Book Edition

Bad On Paper

The hosts engage in a spirited 'Would You Rather' debate centered on various book tropes, writing styles, and reading preferences. They shar

Key takeaways

• Becca visited the Penguin Random House office to film content and hold finished copies of her upcoming book.
• The hosts debate 'open door' vs. 'closed door' romance, noting that well-executed closed-door scenes can maintain high intimacy.

Main topics

• Romance Tropes
• Writing Mechanics

Notable quotes

The door is too open. Let's close it a little, maybe.

Conclusion

A delightful exploration of the technical and emotional nuances that d

Transcript preview

Speaker 1 (0:17) Hi, everyone, and welcome to Bad on Paper podcast. I'm Olivia Mentor. And Speaker 2 (0:21) I'm Becca Freeman. Speaker 1 (0:22) And today we have what I think is going to be a very fun episode of Would You Rather book edition. Speaker 2 (0:29) Strong opinions abound. And I think the listeners are going to have strong opinions of their own. Speaker 1 (0:34) I can't wait. Speaker 2 (0:36) Notably, I did not put in which would you rather dog ear or bookmark because I know that I will get destroyed. Speaker 1 (0:44) Because you're a dog ear. I'm a dog ear. I think you have your people out there, though. I think you'd be surprised. Well, what was your high? Speaker 2 (0:50) Okay, so my high was yesterday I went in to Penguin Random House's office to film some video content for my book. And it was so fun for so many reasons. But on the whole, it just made this thing that feels quite intangible to me right now feel really real. I got to hold a... finished copy of my book for the first time, which is always exciting. I recorded a bunch of video for it. I signed a bunch of books. I got to meet my marketer in person for the first time, which was she was so lovely. I got to see some other people from my team. Oh, I ran into Annabelle Monaghan in the lobby, which I was like, that seems fake. I know it's not, but it seems like I was like getting in the revolving door. And I was just like, that's Annabelle Monaghan. And I was like, wow, I'm really in the right place if I just run into her casually somewhere. In life, I mean, not like physically. It's Speaker 1 (1:50) like a moment from a platonic, from a friend-mance, if you will. I was going to say a platonic romantic comedy, but a friend-mance. That's lovely. Speaker 2 (1:59) You're so right. It was so fun. I loved my outfit. I just, it was really great. Speaker 1 (2:04) The outfit was great. I loved the red. You looked so happy and... pretty in every photo that you posted from it. It just looked like a great day. Oh Speaker 2 (2:12) my gosh. Also, can I tell you a fun fact I learned? Speaker 1 (2:15) You can. So Speaker 2 (2:16) the penguin of Penguin Random House, his name is Alan. Do Speaker 1 (2:21) you know why? Speaker 2 (2:22) So I think it is in honor of the founder of Penguin Random House, who was A-L-L-E-N. But this is spelled for reasons I do not understand, A-L-A-N. They're like, it can't be the same. Yeah. Speaker 1 (2:35) It's Speaker 2 (2:36) just loosely inspired. It's not him. Speaker 1 (2:38) Okay, fair enough. I like that he has his own identity. I found that delightful to know that he has a name. I really like that. I did not know that. A fun fact indeed. Speaker 2 (2:47) What about Speaker 1 (2:48) you? What's your high? My high is that I had on Monday and Tuesday of this week, two high travel days, which I'll be honest and say, Sunday night, I was like, I have so much to do this week. Why did I say yes to all these things? Not that I didn't want to do them. It was just one of those weeks where I was like, I need to be in my office locked in, like locked in both physically and mentally. I need to be locked in. But I had like four hours of travel both days. So on Monday, I went to Bronxville to moderate an event for the author Mimi Montgomery, who wrote the book Murder Bites, which I've talked about on here before. Hilarious. book. It has a cover that reminds me of The Road to Tender Hearts, if that sparks any memories for you guys. And turns out she got the same illustrator to do it because she loved it so much, which I was like, I love that for you. Oh, Speaker 2 (3:40) wow. So you really, you clued in. Speaker 1 (3:42) Yes. That's what it made me think of immediately. So it really delighted me that it was literally the same illustrator, but they're distinct, but there's definitely a similar sensibility, of course. Anyway, so it was in Bronxville, which I had never been to. It's in, I think it's in Westchester. It's two hours from me. So I drove the two hours there, drove the two hours back, but it was at this new bookstore there called Periwinkle Books, which just opened, I think a month ago. And it was beautiful. It was their first ever event, which felt really special. And I don't know, it was just one of the things where I didn't feel like going. Not because I didn't want to support her, because of course I did. It was just the travel of it all. And me saying yes to everything all the time. But I was so, so glad I did. And I loved getting to know her a bit. I loved the conversation. She's a journalist at Axios, which is really interesting. And this book is so funny and sort of irreverent and interesting. And it was a great crowd and a great store. And the owners were so excited. And so, yeah, it was just one of those moments where I was like, I'm glad that I did this. This was worth it. And I was really happy. Oh, good. And then on Tuesday morning, I went back south to the city and I met up with Ayanna, who is still on this press tour, talking about her experience with postpartum psychosis. And she was a guest on the Tamron Hall show. And she brought me as her plus one. Speaker 2 (5:05) Okay. So I saw this on maybe on her story. And I almost sent you some very all caps text. Because at first, I thought that she brought you to meet Oprah. Speaker 1 (5:19) Oh, no, that would be really cool. I didn't even meet Tamron Hall. I was literally just backstage for the entire thing, which was actually very cool. I bet. If I met Oprah, everyone would know immediately. But yeah, it was just, I don't know. I keep talking about how proud of her I am. But it was this really cool moment of watching someone do a really brave thing in real time. It was so great to see her and she did so well. And it was very interesting to see how it works. Like all the people that go into a show like that. It's amazing. Speaker 2 (5:54) Oh, I bet. I went to see a taping of Seth Meyers as an audience member, and I was fascinated by the choreography of it all and just how competent everyone was at their jobs. Speaker 1 (6:06) Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. And there were two stools backstage that just both had the word whoopee. laminated on them because they shoot the view there as well. Oh. So Speaker 2 (6:17) Whoopi Speaker 1 (6:17) Goldberg. And I thought that was delightful. My mind went to Whoopi Cushion. I guess that could be it too, but I don't think so somehow. It was just cool to watch her shine and to, you know, be in a cool building. And then I came on home. So it was also, it was just back to back good days. I'm glad that I said yes and did the things and I'm honored that both of them wanted to have me at their things. Speaker 2 (6:40) May our friends and book tour moderators all talk about us with the reverence that you do about your friends and conversation partners. So lovely. Thank Speaker 1 (6:52) you. Tell me about your low, though. My Speaker 2 (6:55) low is that this week, the overwhelm has set in with publishing. I thought I could maybe hold it off two more weeks. Turns Speaker 1 (7:06) out I Speaker 2 (7:06) can't. I'm still excited. I was telling you before we started recording, it's not negative. Like, it's not like I'm scared or feeling comparison-y. It's just that I'm overwhelmed because I've added on some press stuff this week, which is all really exciting. Like, I've done a few written interviews. I have a couple podcast interviews. I've done a couple video things, and I'm so glad to have them. But it has added hours into my schedule. and like things to think about. And I am breaking. Like, I feel like my executive function is going like I'm just like, can somebody please tell me what to do at all times? Because I'm overwhelmed and I cannot make any more decisions. Speaker 1 (7:51) Yeah, it sneaks up on you, you know, and you're just like moving along. You're like, this is fine. And it's like, here's five more things. Speaker 2 (7:57) Yeah, I like I really feel like I had all the plates spinning until this week. And then. I no longer have the plate spinning. And I was telling you last week when things were fine, I volunteered to host Mahjong tonight because I was like, oh, this will be great. I'll have people over before book craziness sets in. And then this morning I woke up and I was like, I'm sorry, I have to clean my apartment and cook for people and do my whole work day. And like, I am broken. Speaker 1 (8:23) No, I would have, as I told you, I would have canceled. But you're right. You probably will enjoy it. Yes, I think Speaker 2 (8:30) having a social outlet and like socially touching grass will be really good. But I'm I'm feeling head spinny. Touch Speaker 1 (8:39) the social grass. I Speaker 2 (8:40) will. What about you? Speaker 1 (8:42) Not totally dissimilar to you. I am going on vacation on Saturday, just a few days from a couple days from now as we record this. And I always have this list of things, as I'm sure everyone does, that you're like. If I get this list of things done, I will enjoy my vacation even more because I will have accomplished all of this. It will be off my plate. I had a list of things for the house, a list of things for work, a list of things for life. None of them are done. None of, not a one, not a one. Pedicure, not happening. These hooves are going unpolished to the beach. Book stuff, I'm behind. House stuff, a mess. It's just every day I'm like, almost there. No. Laundry. Probably won't be done before I go. I'll be honest. I'll probably be doing it there. It's really not the way I wanted to enter this relaxing week away. And I'm glad that we're getting away from the projects for a bit, but I'm probably going to have to work when I'm there, which wasn't, they're worse things, you know, it's writing about the beach at the beach. So I'm happy for that, but it was not my plan. And I'm a little bit disappointed in myself about that, I think. But it's OK. Oh, Speaker 2 (9:55) I totally get that. I feel like when you get trapped in the swirl of I need to work on vacation so that I don't freak out, but then I'm going to freak out that I'm not enjoying myself enough. Like it's like a vicious circle that you get caught in. Speaker 1 (10:12) Yeah, it is. I think I'm just going to do like three hours every morning and just have happy enough. I mean, good for you. But I think I just need to set up some perimeters around it, you know, like because I'm getting into this mode of like I'm going to finish it while I'm there and like that's not going to happen. So now Speaker 2 (10:33) we'll Speaker 1 (10:33) see. Speaker 2 (10:33) Do you think touching social grass will be helpful in your case Speaker 1 (10:37) or no? I think Jake and I need to be away from this house. OK, so I think that will be very helpful for us just to take a breather and to come back and. just have a bit of renewed energy for it because we are both very worn down Speaker 2 (10:54) by Speaker 1 (10:55) not being in a normal routine. So yeah, I'm looking forward to that and it'll be good. I think it will be good. I'll touch ocean. Speaker 2 (11:03) Touch ocean. Oh my gosh. Yes. What cannot be healed by touching ocean? Speaker 1 (11:07) It's true. Words to live by. Speaker 2 (11:09) Okay. We've done our wallowing complaining. Let us touch controversy. But I think this is going to be really fun. Let's have some fun. Quick ad break. We'll be back with Which Would You Rather. Speaker 1 (11:26) One of the things that has been hardest about not being able to cook for ourselves is that it's so much more difficult to make sure that we're eating a balanced diet with all kinds of nutrients. And this is exactly why I made sure to keep my Ritual Women's Multivitamin 18 Plus. In an easy-to-reach location during all of this renovation, Ritual's team of scientists poured over thousands of studies to identify the common gaps between nutrient needs and what people are actually consuming across different life stages to support foundational health. Speaker 2 (11:56) I take my multivitamin after I brush my teeth because it has like a minty essence to it. And that is such a big deal to me because unlike other vitamins I've tried, this one doesn't have a funky aftertaste. Like I've taken ones. that literally taste like licking the ocean floor. And that does not make me want to make it a part of my routine, but this is totally pleasant. We also all know how much I love going to the doctor and getting blood work done. And a multivitamin just gives me like that confidence that I'm getting everything I need between appointments. Speaker 1 (12:32) I am personally low in vitamin D, and I love knowing that Ritual conducted a university-led clinical trial for their women's multivitamin 18 plus to test its efficacy. It actually increased vitamin D levels by 43 % and omega-3 DHA levels by 41 % in just 12 weeks. So instead of striving for perfect health, support your foundational health. Save 25 % on your first month at ritual.com slash bad on paper. That's ritual.com slash bad on paper for 25 % off your first month. Speaker 2 (13:09) All right. So I wanted to do this episode because a few weeks ago, maybe a couple months ago, to be honest with you, I was listening to the Radio 831 podcast hosted by Sanjana Bhaskar and Tyler McCall. And this is 831 Stories, the Romance Imprints podcast, and I have been loving it recently. But they were having a conversation in kind of their beginning matter about open versus closed door sex scenes. And I was like walking around my neighborhood talking to the air about sex, which is weird. Speaker 1 (13:46) But I like had such strong feelings and Speaker 2 (13:49) I thought, oh, this would be a really fun episode to talk about some of these polarizing opinions with books and do like a which would you rather episode. So I love this idea. Starting with the inspiration, Olivia. open versus closed door sex scene? I will say in a romance. Okay. Well, I would say Speaker 1 (14:12) open by a hair. Tell me more. By Speaker 2 (14:14) a Speaker 1 (14:14) hair. And also, it can be too much. Let's just say that. There's a certain level where it becomes too much open door. The door is too open. Let's close it a little, maybe. That's just a personal preference. I think that if it's too much, it can become the only driving force of the story in a way that I don't like. And if it's too little, like if the door is completely closed, I feel like I'm missing a little bit of something. So a good happy medium is the best for me. But wait, I want to know what you were saying out loud on that walk. What did you have very strong reactions about? What were they saying? What did you agree with? What is your take here? Speaker 2 (14:51) So both hosts came on the side of open door. And they were saying, rightfully, I totally agree that in romance, how the characters interact physically is character development. It is plot. And it's really tantamount to, you know, how we're rooting for this couple or how we're understanding them, their issues, et cetera. Like, I feel like oftentimes in a book with multiple sex scenes, you're seeing an evolution of, you know, whether it's how comfortable the characters are with each other or their confidence or something that they're working through on like a bigger macro. character level. And so I totally agree with that. And I would have definitely said 100 % open door if you'd asked me a few years ago. But I think in the past few years, I've read a few romances that are closed door that are so well done that I'm like open door with an asterisk if done well. Speaker 1 (15:51) Yeah, I hear you. I do think there's like a certain talent that it takes to make a closed door sex scene feel as I was going to say full, but really that's Speaker 2 (16:00) not Speaker 1 (16:00) the word I want to use for this topic. Yeah, Speaker 2 (16:03) intimate. To Speaker 1 (16:04) make you feel intimate and to give you those butterflies in the same way. Speaker 2 (16:07) Yeah, like I read Practice Makes Perfect by Sarah Adams, which is the second book in her Rome, Kentucky series. And this is a fun trope. It's like a dating lessons trope where all the different books follow a group of siblings and the youngest sister is very shy and not comfortable. dating. And she has this arrangement with this bad boy bodyguard who's like a lady's man who's giving her dating lessons. And as they're getting closer, there are some scenes where nothing is even happening, but it is so intimate and it is so sexy that I was like, oh my gosh. And so ultimately, you know, I think there's kissing, maybe a little touching. fade to black. But I was like, oh my gosh, this is so well done. Like, in this case, I was totally satisfied with closed door sex. Speaker 1 (17:05) People love her books so much. I'm sure this is part of why. They're Speaker 2 (17:09) so good. It's really interesting because that series started as closed door, but then by the last book, it was open door. Speaker 1 (17:16) Did you prefer one or the other? Speaker 2 (17:19) I'm not sure that I can say accurately. Because I liked the middle two books much more because of the characters, but I don't really know that it had to do with like the level of chili peppers or steam or anything. Speaker 1 (17:35) Okay. Were you like nervous at all? You were like, oh, she's so good at doing it closed door. Speaker 2 (17:40) No, I was excited. I